When the dream of the house bursts

I can understand that. Really. It must be terrible not to have this wish fulfilled.
Still, it remains highly selfish. And when you then hear how many failed attempts (with termination) preceded it, it's really hard to feel even an ounce of sympathy (for the child yes, for the parents no).

How do you come to that? I think you have no idea what you're talking about! It is selfish...when parents' "only real meaning" of life remains unfulfilled and great science can help at this point? You have absolutely no idea what kind of psychological consequences that can have.

I can understand that. Really. It must be horrible not to have that wish fulfilled. Nevertheless, it remains extremely selfish. And when you then hear how many failed attempts (with termination) preceded it, it really becomes hard to feel even a spark of sympathy (for the child yes, for the parents no).

Do you have friends who had one miscarriage after another? Not terminations, that's in the category too stupid to prevent or My child is my accessory.

That might be possible, but I am just relieved that I don’t have to. Full-time work + household + child(ren) = zero or negative... who ends up suffering? At least the women who would also like to have a hobby that isn’t called child...

But once again that leads away from the topic.

Full-time + child + hobby + time for me

For the household there is a cleaning lady who mops, vacuums, and irons once a week. Otherwise, yes, you can’t eat off the floor here, it is sometimes chaotic, you can see that a child is letting off steam here and cat paws are often muddy at the moment. So what

The day has 24 hours. It just takes organization.

I believe Alex85 was not concerned about late birth due to fertility problems, but rather because of an accelerated shaping of the professional career. He is annoyed that sometimes the compatibility of child and career is bought at the cost of increased health risks to the child.

I know another model: having children during studies. Using university childcare. By the time of starting a career, kindergarten or even school age is reached. Completely different conditions. Actually good.
But they get so much pushback from other self-proclaimed model parents, like "not being able to offer anything to the child," that it makes you want to drop your jaw.
Those who confidently walk through that are well-grounded characters.

We had our first child at 24 while being students. I also see it that women over 30 are already giving birth late if it is the first pregnancy. By 35 it should be "over," otherwise the man has to find a younger woman.

I believe Alex85 was not talking about late birth due to fertility problems, but about deliberately shaping the career path early. He is annoyed that sometimes the compatibility of child and career is bought at the cost of increased health risks for the child.

I know another model: having children during university studies. Using university childcare. By the time the career starts, the child is in kindergarten or even school age. Completely different conditions. Actually good.
But those people get criticized so much by other self-proclaimed model parents, with things like "not being able to offer anything to the child," that you just drop your jaw.
Anyone who confidently goes through that is a strong character.

Let's be honest, no matter how you do it, you do it wrong. Especially when it comes to children, everyone thinks they can interfere and that their own opinion or upbringing is the only right one.
Either you're a helicopter mom, a neglectful mother, a lenient mother, a too soft mother without rules, you let the child get away with too much, you're too strict, you work too long, you don't work at all...
I could list for hours and I haven't even gotten to the topic of rear-facing car seats or complementary feeding [emoji85][emoji28]

I think we should all just relax a bit and let everyone have their own way without judging