Single-family house (2 floors + residential basement + developed attic) approximately 200 sqm - changes

Are there no feedback on the new floor plan?

Are there no responses to the new floor plan?

Hardly any. We have no desire to repeatedly search your amateur floor plans for fundamental errors.
And especially not when the financing is questionable and the personal contributions are completely unrealistic for a father of three.

Here is another example:

I took stairs from the catalog.

Which catalog? Maybe at Otto?
You didn’t write down your stair dimensions even though we asked. So if I calculated correctly, it looks something like this:


Totally unacceptable.

Since you won’t be dissuaded from your tower: your floor plan will be created by the architect for you. You need that anyway in order to draw up the building applications. So you can’t save on that. It’s mandatory. You already have one, you claim in the opening post. What about that one? Has it also lost interest?

I personally think the OP naturally tries to work a lot on floor plans himself. What has come out of it so far is probably somewhat relative...

Why invest evening after evening ? Better to have a conversation with the announced architect, let the architect do their job and then discuss the result. There are really some floor plan professionals here who will give valuable tips on a reasonable basis.

There is still a significant difference between a 45° and a 50° roof - please refer to the clearance regulations:
At least in Bavaria, the following applies:

(4) 1The depth of the clearance area is determined by the wall height; it is measured perpendicular to the wall. 2Wall height is the measurement from the terrain surface to the intersection of the wall with the roof covering or to the upper edge of the wall. 3The height of roofs with a slope of more than 70 degrees is fully counted, for roofs with a slope of more than 45 degrees one third is added.

So for your 50° roof, one third of the wall height of the roof is added. I don't have the site plan in mind right now, but since it is going to be such a tower anyway, it could indeed become tight.

Which catalog? Maybe from Otto?

That one doesn't exist anymore, does it?
*slap on the thigh*

I personally think the OP is, of course, trying a lot himself with floor plans. What has been created so far is probably somewhat relative...

Why invest evening after evening . Better to seek a conversation with the announced architect, let the architect do his job, and then discuss the result. There are really some floor plan pros here who will still give valuable tips on a reasonable basis.

Currently, I can't do anything else but work on the floor plan and have others look at it. Unfortunately, the latter succeeds only a little here, because it's only about defining knee walls, upper floor, attic, and tower buildings. But I haven't lost hope that someone will say something about the floor plan.

We had an appointment with the architect yesterday. The current offer includes 2.635 m clear shell height in basement and ground floor as well as underfloor heating in all basement rooms. It just wasn’t described in the offer. So far so good.
Since the decision has now been made not to live in the basement, we discussed what changes if the basement is built completely underground. Problematic is that groundwater was found at 3.20 m. The river is only about 200 m away, and historically the property lies on the old riverbed. An influence of the groundwater level from the river is expected. This was confirmed by the long dry spell before the Boden drilling. So it must be assumed that the basement at least partially stands in groundwater.
Together with the house builder’s representative (I have no idea if that’s the correct term), we did some calculations and came to the conclusion that we mainly save because the entrance platform will be eliminated and because of the extra basement access, and the rest doesn’t move much. The increase of the upper floor by a full meter and all other things were roughly estimated quite high. In the end, we were still at about 20k less, despite:

[*]2.635 m clear shell height basement
[*]underfloor heating also in the basement (cold is not possible due to bricks)
[*]and basement sealed against pressing groundwater.

That was great at first. With this, we moved back in the planning towards 400k including all additional building costs (I have to recalculate, but I think with lime plaster we are currently around 420k). And since this would be the first house to get cheaper, we plan to definitely end up at 450k.
Regarding floor plan and architect: We searched a long time (so far among solid prefabricated house providers) until we came across an architect where we had the feeling that he understands why we want these things. All the others, for example, talked us out of the basement. But I know our past life and know that I would always miss it. So it must be there unless it’s not affordable. The last floor plan was an attempt to make many compromises to fulfill almost all wishes somehow. But there were too many compromises. Therefore, back one round and took an earlier floor plan. He has it and is looking at it. Structurally, the new staircase on the ground floor even seems better, because despite the larger width of the living/dining room, it has a wall to support. He also sees the staircase as the most exciting but was optimistic. He wants to draw the new draft and get back to us next week. That’s why I still sit at the floor plan every evening and still hope for feedback:

[*]We have not yet signed any contract with the architect or anything. No signature or anything. No idea if we already owe him money or not. I assume his costs will then be included in the house construction. But I also don’t want to create the feeling that it could happen that I have let him invest 5 times 5 hours to draw plans (we already had about 10 hours of conversation with him and 3 hours with the house builder) and each time I then said he should start again because something suddenly came to my mind. That’s why I would like the floor plans to be somehow fed back beforehand. That didn’t work with the last one. But it was actually born of too much willingness to compromise. The new one is not that far from standard designs for small houses. Usually only ground floor and attic with 1m knee wall and unbuilt roof. But we want to use the roof planned and the basement as utility room/storage/workshop/fitness, ...
[*]I think even an architect can make a mistake in planning. Either one that can really be proven as a standard (DIN) error or one that simply nobody thought of. I believe that in such a forum many people can come up with different usage possibilities and find pitfalls of a floor plan. I would be interested in those. Not that our house allegedly looks like a tower from outside. By the way, I attached a picture of how it is currently projected. It’s not a city villa but I don’t think it looks completely crazy in a settlement with almost exclusively multi-family houses (The windows are all still not in the right place! - I would like feedback on that too)
[*]I have nothing else to do right now with the biggest project of my life

There is a significant difference between a 45° and a 50° roof - please look up the setback regulations:
At least in Bavaria it applies:

(4) 1The depth of the setback area is determined according to the wall height; it is measured perpendicular to the wall. 2Wall height is the measurement from ground surface to the intersection of the wall with the roof covering or to the upper edge of the wall. 3The height of roofs with a pitch of more than 70 degrees is counted fully, roofs with a pitch of more than 45 degrees are counted one-third.

So with your 50° roof, one-third of the wall height of the roof is added. I don’t remember the site plan now but since it’s going to be a tower anyway, it could get quite tight.

Thank you very much! I haven’t thought about increased setback dimensions yet and hope/think that the architect has this in mind. The gable currently has a wall height of 10.90. That times 0.4 would give a setback height of 4.36 m and thus more than 3 m to the parking lot. The other sides don’t matter. And since it’s the gable, the roof pitch is also irrelevant. But I still have to inform myself exactly how the setback of the gable wall looks. In an emergency, I would hope that building over is also allowed because the neighboring plot is not buildable. I would have to measure, but it has definitely less than 15 m width.
I started reading about this topic in the Saxony building code and only found the following regarding the roof pitch: "The depth of the setback area is determined according to the wall height. It is measured perpendicular to the wall. Wall height is the size from the ground surface to the intersection of the wall with the roof covering or to the upper edge of the wall. The height of roofs with a pitch of less than 70 degrees is added to one-third of the wall height. Otherwise, the height of the roof is added fully. Sentences 1 through 4 apply correspondingly to roof structures. The resulting size is H."
From this, I see three possible calculations:

[*]("only" the height of ground and upper floor * 0.4) + (the height of the gable wall (without ground and upper floor) * 0.33 * 0.4)
[*]("only" the height of ground and upper floor * 0.4) + (the height of the gable wall (without ground and upper floor) * 0.33)
[*]complete gable wall height * 0.4 (because it’s the gable side - but I found nothing on this)

Hardly. We don’t want to constantly have to search your amateur floor plans for fundamental errors.
And certainly not when the financing is questionable and the DIY efforts are completely unrealistic for a father of three.

Here is another example:


Which catalog? Maybe at Otto?
You didn’t write the dimensions of your stairs, although we asked for it. So if I calculated correctly, it looks something like this:


Completely unacceptable.

Since you won’t be talked out of your tower: The floor plan is created for you by the architect. You need it anyway to draw the building permits. You can’t save on that. It’s required. You say you already have one in the original post. What about that one? Has he lost interest too?

Hello kaho674,
I would really ask you to get back to the issue level. This is not a forum for "floor plan pros amongst themselves," but as I understand it, ideas can be discussed here. I have also seen other posts from you in other threads. Often you are the fastest! Congratulations. But often also with very little empathy for the fact that people here may have already thought about things at an unprofessional level and maybe have already seen and tried different things and also found reasons for things that don’t suffice as a reason for you because you don’t appreciate the result that much. You also like to reply: away with this, like that, different that way. Please take a second to breathe and ask why the things are as they are and say what you would do differently. Of course, this is just my "few posters" wish, but I think it could significantly ease the tone here. If I moderated here, I would have given you a notice like this several times. I find it sanctionable that you have been regularly intrusive since about page 5! You do not know what DIY work I can deliver! You can and should express concerns. Please do the rest with people who can and have to assess such intrusions (that could be family, for example).
Anyway, I have the feeling that you now scan almost every post of mine only for inconsistencies and then comment disparagingly (see Otto catalog). Why don’t you behave like a person interested in a peaceful atmosphere and ask which catalog I used?
Anyway: if it remains the case that you do not provide a meaningful contribution or the more sensible people focus on the fact that you misunderstand me (where I sometimes have to assume intent), then please don’t escalate this thread further.
If you are interested in helping: I have attached 3 pictures of the stairs. I already had some dimensions on there before that you overlooked. Now I have probably added almost all necessary ones! Important: the landings at the top are decisive and below I have drawn the currently longest possible one (regarding the stair length). This is limited by the head clearance under the stairs and the roof and especially by the first floor access to the WC. But a change would still be possible there.
If the stair on the upper floor also starts double-spiraled downstairs, the stairwell would have to be 10 cm wider.
The catalog I used is simply the model catalog in the free version of Sweet Home 3D. I have already looked for a suitable program for 2D floor plans including stairs and have not found anything yet.