Tactics when buying a kitchen / how to negotiate properly?

The kitchen market itself unfortunately often employs this deliberately non-transparent sales practice.
I find it quite strange that or a kitchen customer at all needs such a thread called "Tactics for buying a kitchen," which arises precisely from this deliberately created lack of transparency towards the customer.
If someone here writes that they saved or negotiated something, it only reflects their personal feeling of satisfaction and by no means a reality, because for that you would have to know a real "normal price." But this is deliberately obscured by juggling packages, fronts, appliances, etc., or shaped almost arbitrarily with previous astronomical prices or 0%-offers.
The kitchen sector is somewhat different from other topics in house construction, which can be rather compared, also based on the description of the offer or targeted inquiry. When buying a kitchen, a real comparison for the average consumer is almost impossible.
I find this development almost terrible because as a customer I have to distrust my counterpart or otherwise live with the great risk of being taken advantage of because I was too naive.
When I finally asked about the cost of this large kitchen without appliances, things suddenly got weird. I told him to simply calculate the kitchen normally for himself and then sell it to me without appliances... oh dear. When he then came to me with his guarantee for inserting an oven and plugging in the appliance, that was the end for me.
I never have a problem paying a high price for good quality and work, but lack of transparency and sales pressure generally cause me to want to run away.
Therefore, I believe it is important to find the existing "gems" that provide good consultation plus performance and then pay the price it costs there.
Since my acquaintance unfortunately no longer distributes kitchens and due to my recent experiences, I switched to Ikea and enjoy their price transparency and also quality; in addition, I outfit the kitchen with appliances of my choice.
If I find a provider here again who does not work with sales pressure, astronomical prices, or bait offers, it can be different again.

We wanted a specific brand (Häcker), then looked where it was offered and went to the 1st of 2 stores. Planned quite okay but unsympathetic guy. Planned online ourselves, emailed the whole thing to the 2nd store and at the appointment it was already done. A bit more expensive, but friendlier owner. Signed, done. Who earned what now - no idea but we found the price okay. Devices all went through us separately because of employee prices.

I really don’t understand what you always mean by lack of transparency?!
If you get a quote for the exact same kitchen from the same brand at 3 different studios and furniture stores, you get an average price.
What is a real "normal price"?!
What is a real "normal price" for a car? What about for landscaping?
Do you also go out to eat and negotiate the price for a glass of cola with the waiter because you know that a liter costs 0.9 euros at the supermarket?
Or do you say in a fancy restaurant that the schnitzel for 30,- is way too expensive and the pricing is not transparent?

Have you ever bought something at the furniture store that was later offered at a 50% discount? Didn’t that annoy you because that’s when you see what kind of margins industries like that work with?
But you still wouldn’t have been able to negotiate that 50% discount back then

Just buy the book: "Clever Küchen kaufen". We have worked through it completely and will start using it at the end of the year. I can't tell you if everything will work 100% afterwards, but the industry is really intense and you learn exactly what to pay attention to.

If you want a better price, you need information/negotiation skills/a lot of knowledge.

Acquire that, otherwise you can't negotiate. If that is too much work for you, then you have to be satisfied with what you get for it.

It takes much more than just saying: "give me 3%, how much room do you still have?"

It takes much more than just saying: "give me 3%, how much leeway do you still have"

What can one say according to the book?

The kitchen is not a never-ending story for me. I have had quite precise ideas for a long time. But they have become more and more concrete through the 4 visits. Besides, you naturally have to spend a lot of time on the topic. The open kitchen will be the heart of the house. And if I hadn’t said myself that the cooktop should be flush-mounted and that I want an undermount sink, no one would have suggested that to me. Also, no one would have planned a base cabinet with a waste system, meaning the trash bin under the countertop, on their own.

And I don’t think about pricing at restaurants. But there I only pay a one- or two-digit amount too much… I can live with that. With kitchens, I feel like people are gladly relieved of a few thousand euros too much.

I can well understand that then prefers to buy at Ikea.

What is a real "normal price" for a car?

Here we are talking about buying a kitchen NEW and with cars there is already a published price.

What about gardening?

I can agree on an hourly basis or a flat rate and I commission exactly what and how I want it; if I replace the pansy with the tulip, I pay the extra price for the tulip, the stone, etc., which I can take from a price list.

Do you also go out to eat and negotiate the price of a glass of cola with the waiter because you know that a liter costs 0.9 euros at the supermarket?

Of course, simply calling others completely stupid is also an option; in a class test this polemic would probably be judged as "off topic." You equate price- and quality-conscious actions with stinginess or downright stupid thinking. Besides, I don’t drink cola—

Or do you tell the fancy restaurant that the schnitzel for 30 euros is way too expensive and that the calculation is non-transparent?

...using another example doesn’t really make the previous one any better, even if the intent seems to be to make you look even dumber.
Do you really eat "Schnitztl" in a fancy restaurant? You should urgently reconsider your choice of restaurant or the categorization of this establishment—

Have you ever bought something in a furniture store that was later offered at a 50% discount? Didn’t that annoy you because you only then see what kind of margins such industries work with?

Multiple things are mixed arbitrarily to positively present something else. By the way, not only "such industries" work with margins, after all that is the purpose of selling, to generate a margin, isn’t it? Stores without margins usually don’t last very long on the market—.
If I am interested in a calculation that makes sense to me, which is willingly explained to me after various inquiries as a customer, in my opinion that does not necessarily have to be equated with stinginess or stupidity.

But you would never have been able to negotiate the 50% back then anyway

Possibly yes—but that’s not what this is about.

The market in general has unfortunately developed that way, also with "stinginess is cool," astronomical prices with included deception, aggressively operating comparison portals, etc., which probably affect ALL of us to a greater or lesser extent, whether we want to admit it or not.
No , I have always paid for my things without any deduction, but I simply don’t like having to haggle to get a fair price or to recognize that something is being hidden in the price. That’s why I choose my points of sale differently, based on quality and comprehensible pricing, and have little trouble with that myself. But the question is about the OP, who is understandably uncertain.

As already mentioned, I have a friend who has worked in this industry all his life and even he tells me that nowadays the "good ones" have to resort to rather obscure methods because of this aggressive development so as not to be eaten up by the market; not least because of this, he quit.
By the way, I built my house back then WITHOUT ever receiving a price offer for anything and WITHOUT signing with a craftsman, I paid every invoice exactly as it came in and was completely satisfied with the house construction. I relied solely on the quality of my craftsmen and paid what it cost; simple and without comparing.
This general categorization into kitchen customers who behave quality-consciously and "properly" and those stingy-greedy bargain hunters who want everything for free and do not "allow" the service provider a fair margin surely misses the point.
There is a deliberately created lack of transparency in large parts of the kitchen market (also furniture, prefab house construction in many parts), which can be read about in information sources regarded as serious. If you know that you can orient yourself accordingly and adjust your behavior.
Simply claiming that this is not the case at all is of course also an allowed approach, but portraying those who think or act differently as stupid (see comparisons) does not necessarily seem appropriate.