Gas with solar thermal? Or heat pump with photovoltaics? Consultation

  • Erstellt am 2020-02-05 08:57:29

seat88

2020-02-08 18:50:19
  • #1


Storage systems are getting cheaper, but will never be free. Therefore, a calculation that can be conveniently made for both gas and photovoltaics...
 

hegi___

2020-02-08 19:17:21
  • #2
They do not have to be free, but the breakeven between electricity purchase costs and production costs with storage must be exceeded...
 

T_im_Norden

2020-02-08 19:27:43
  • #3
Chimney sweep is every 3 years.

Condensing boiler does not need a chimney, only an exhaust pipe.

Gas connection 2000 euros versus geothermal probe >=10,000 euros still results in 3000 euros plus for gas.

You can look at and calculate everything from different perspectives.
 

Nordlys

2020-02-08 19:32:11
  • #4
Chimney sweeper every two years for 90,- so less than 50 per year. Connection here 750,- Which chimney? A pipe goes up from the boiler. Done. And something is always left out, the LWWP is technically significantly more complex than the gas boiler and therefore more maintenance-intensive and prone to errors. That then results in technician costs. Also, the durability of the pump is, according to the current state of technology, about 10 years. That means a major investment would be due then. Conclusion. There will always be people who are tech-savvy and want what is new or interesting and make it look good financially. Purely economically, however, you usually do better with simple rugged reliable. Owners of highly complex cars know this, which is why, for example, company fleets prefer Astra or Focus base models over Tesla or something like that. Karsten
 

ares83

2020-02-08 20:15:40
  • #5


You don’t need the geothermal probe, but you do need the connection, so the comparison is flawed. Actually, everyone does that. It’s a very individual matter. In our northwest region, most houses are built by general contractors; here with us in Nuremberg, only 10% of the houses are self-built. The rest were built with general contractors. What matters is what you end up with in the end. In our case, it was cheaper to build KfW55 with an air-water heat pump than the standard energy saving regulations with gas, because the central controlled ventilation system was set for us and the KfW conditions in 2016 were significantly cheaper than a regular loan. For others, it’s the opposite; nothing can be generalized.



Even though I usually appreciate your posts, a lot is wrong here. An air-water heat pump is not particularly complicated. It’s basically a reversed refrigerator; when you look inside, you’re surprised how simple such a thing is built. And a refrigerator is far from high-tech. You can do maintenance yourself; it costs nothing. The lifespan is also comparable to a gas condensing boiler; I haven’t heard otherwise so far. These things also sometimes run 20-30 years without major complaints.

The thing about company fleets is much more due to the bargain prices offered by manufacturers in leasing. Leasing factors of 0.5 or 0.6 are not uncommon; a Golf was recently available for under 100€ per month to lease privately. A 5er BMW was available at model change for 249 per month. Tesla, on the other hand, has totally unattractive conditions. And it’s actually the combustion engine with all its ancillary parts and necessary exhaust aftertreatment that is the mega complex beast. See timing belt issues at VW, timing chain problems at BMW, the EGR valves are practically expensive wear parts at many manufacturers, and so on. Compared to that, an electric motor with its surroundings is very simple—in fact, it is rather simple rugged reliable.
 

Bookstar

2020-02-08 20:45:05
  • #6

Do you have any sources for this untrue claim? However, I know that the manufacturers design the systems for a maximum of 15 years; much more frequently, these air pumps fail after 5 to 10 years. You can probably operate a gas condensing boiler for 30 years without major repairs.

I don’t believe in the heat pump, even though I have one myself, which by the way has already had quite a few defects.
 

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