rainario1
2020-05-05 20:54:18
- #1
Thank you for your opinions/contributions, (especially for the detailed message from MayrCh).
The 0815 manufacturer did not want to have this dictated in the contract... as mentioned, there was talk of "the possibility of additional measures" to achieve improved sound insulation within the building (diamond plate and sound-decoupled ceiling). So without a dedicated architect.
No detailed information about the neighborly partition wall regarding sound insulation. Fire protection class F 90 B.
Since two semi-detached houses are being built (so two walls "next to each other" and the partition wall in between), it is said to be "in any case sufficiently soundproof". In the end, it's all sound and smoke, and then it's too late, which is why I keep harping on it.
Unfortunately, as a layperson, I really cannot assess the competence of the planners, so the approach with the acoustician could certainly make sense. An extra 5,000 euros won’t make much of a difference anyway. Interesting hint!
I am still looking for someone who has done something like this themselves:
Optimizing timber frame construction with an external building acoustician (if yes, with whom, etc.)?
Has anyone ever been so "crazy"? Could this possibly be completely over the top?
I want to make sure that in the end it is experienced in everyday life without any "teeth grinding".
After all, I will likely (optimistically) live there for another 30 to 50 years.
Sound perception is certainly subjective, so I would like to ensure measurably good results. This is not so easy with prefabricated timber frame construction, is it?
My father lives in a solid semi-detached house and gross errors were made regarding sound insulation, which can no longer really be corrected or are difficult to fix (as you also wrote), apparently because a common basement slab or walls built directly adjacent to each other were used... (whatever).
In the end, besides professional planning, proper execution is also important... we agree on that... which again means that afterwards/or better during the construction phase someone must accompany the correct execution of the proper planning ("my" building acoustician).
Does the prefabricated house manufacturer even go along with that?
If one were mean, they could say to me:
then just build a solid house and that's that.
PS: Regarding compliance with 4100 SST II, the Federal Court of Justice (BGH) has, according to Wikipedia, also ruled on condominiums:
With another fundamental decision, the Federal Court of Justice continues this jurisprudence for condominiums as well (Federal Court of Justice, judgment of June 4, 2009 – VII ZR 54/07). Analogous to the semi-detached house, sound insulation levels II and III of the VDI guideline 4100 or supplement 2 to DIN 4109 can be regarded as generally accepted rules of technology for an apartment that is to meet the usual quality and comfort standards. The court makes it clear that mere reference to DIN 4109 in the service description is not sufficient for its effective agreement as contractually owed sound insulation. Rather, the contractor who wishes to deviate from the usual quality and comfort standards for apartments must additionally adequately inform the purchaser about the consequences of simple sound insulation construction for the later living quality.[7]
I am surprised that I find so little about this otherwise. This is certainly a more frequent topic (like "botched construction").
The 0815 manufacturer did not want to have this dictated in the contract... as mentioned, there was talk of "the possibility of additional measures" to achieve improved sound insulation within the building (diamond plate and sound-decoupled ceiling). So without a dedicated architect.
No detailed information about the neighborly partition wall regarding sound insulation. Fire protection class F 90 B.
Since two semi-detached houses are being built (so two walls "next to each other" and the partition wall in between), it is said to be "in any case sufficiently soundproof". In the end, it's all sound and smoke, and then it's too late, which is why I keep harping on it.
Unfortunately, as a layperson, I really cannot assess the competence of the planners, so the approach with the acoustician could certainly make sense. An extra 5,000 euros won’t make much of a difference anyway. Interesting hint!
I am still looking for someone who has done something like this themselves:
Optimizing timber frame construction with an external building acoustician (if yes, with whom, etc.)?
Has anyone ever been so "crazy"? Could this possibly be completely over the top?
I want to make sure that in the end it is experienced in everyday life without any "teeth grinding".
After all, I will likely (optimistically) live there for another 30 to 50 years.
Sound perception is certainly subjective, so I would like to ensure measurably good results. This is not so easy with prefabricated timber frame construction, is it?
My father lives in a solid semi-detached house and gross errors were made regarding sound insulation, which can no longer really be corrected or are difficult to fix (as you also wrote), apparently because a common basement slab or walls built directly adjacent to each other were used... (whatever).
In the end, besides professional planning, proper execution is also important... we agree on that... which again means that afterwards/or better during the construction phase someone must accompany the correct execution of the proper planning ("my" building acoustician).
Does the prefabricated house manufacturer even go along with that?
If one were mean, they could say to me:
then just build a solid house and that's that.
PS: Regarding compliance with 4100 SST II, the Federal Court of Justice (BGH) has, according to Wikipedia, also ruled on condominiums:
With another fundamental decision, the Federal Court of Justice continues this jurisprudence for condominiums as well (Federal Court of Justice, judgment of June 4, 2009 – VII ZR 54/07). Analogous to the semi-detached house, sound insulation levels II and III of the VDI guideline 4100 or supplement 2 to DIN 4109 can be regarded as generally accepted rules of technology for an apartment that is to meet the usual quality and comfort standards. The court makes it clear that mere reference to DIN 4109 in the service description is not sufficient for its effective agreement as contractually owed sound insulation. Rather, the contractor who wishes to deviate from the usual quality and comfort standards for apartments must additionally adequately inform the purchaser about the consequences of simple sound insulation construction for the later living quality.[7]
I am surprised that I find so little about this otherwise. This is certainly a more frequent topic (like "botched construction").