New semi-detached house - smart home setup with an extra 10,000 EUR?

We still have about 10 K EUR left, so the entire (smart) electrics may cost about 22 K EUR. We have planned 13 roller shutters / venetian blinds, which – as it stands now – will get conventional electrics.

You have 10K left to automate a house? That’s already a start. But I wouldn’t really call it smart. The term has become so overused nowadays that it can mean everything and nothing.

But with 10K extra, you can do quite a lot even if it doesn’t seem like it at first glance.

The construction company seems to have only limited expertise regarding smart home, so I am considering how best to proceed.

Yes, the usual. They only do the standard and don’t know anything beyond that. Or at most, here and there, they install some pseudo-smart devices at the client’s request. The main thing is that you can talk to the house and have an app with colorful icons on your phone.

Regarding putting KNX on ice / just basically preparing it, that would mean conventional electrics, i.e. significantly higher costs later, right? You keep reading that it’s not really sensible.

No, you can forget about conventional electrics right away. You have 10K left. Or rather, not just left but can use it sensibly and not waste it. So say goodbye entirely to conventional wiring and invest your 10K where you won’t have access later. That means: bus cables wherever possible and a structured star wiring of the load circuits. Also have the roller shutters wired accordingly from the start. The money should be enough. That way you have a basic framework/skeleton of wiring you can build on later. Better to save a bit on LAN and put the saved money into the wiring. Because afterwards it’s difficult if not impossible to get bus and/or 230V, for example, to the living room ceiling.

That would rather be option 1 for me to start with, so I at least get a bit of central control in the house

The worst thing you could do.

I only see 3a as the only reasonable solution. 3b will come automatically over time. Solutions 1 and 2 are old hat.

Requirements – Must Have:

[*
Lighting:
[LIST]
[*]Control lights centrally (preferably all, if necessary by floor, room-wise or selected areas); partly dimmable


[*]Shading:


[*]Control roller shutters / venetian blinds centrally, automated shading


[*]Power:


[*]Make about 10+ sockets switchable

All of that should be easily possible with the 10K.

Nice to Have:

[*]Waiver of ERR (if justifiable via smart home; I do not intend to actively control the heating)

Cost: exactly 0 euros or you might even be credited money by the general contractor for it. Well, maybe about 100 euros or so.

Connection of controlled residential ventilation

Not necessarily immediately needed. Or depending on the controlled ventilation, maybe doable with onboard means and no KNX needed.

Connection of voice control

Completely overrated and more or less not necessary in a well-planned house—unless you really absolutely need it. But well, a “smart speaker” does not cost the world.

Window contacts

That is one of the cost drivers. But could possibly be attempted as own work or only minimal installation at the start with preparation.

Visualization

You can do that yourself. Rarely necessary at the beginning, as you have other worries then.

Presence detectors

Cost drivers, but can also be done step by step later.

Sonos integration

Possible via many ways and can also be done later.

TKS integration (Doorbird, Busch Jäger Welcome)

Possible as a standalone system at the beginning.

Alarm function (via presence detectors / sensors, possibly also something own e.g. Busch Secure@Home)

That only works once everything is connected, because if you’re missing window contacts or other detectors, then what’s the point at all?

Berlin

Oh, someone from the area again. Which district?

Shellys are not an option. That’s kids’ toys and a noise nuisance.

With a lot of personal effort, KNX would be possible with the planned budget. However, the electrical company must also cooperate. Additionally, one must invest the time and, if necessary, acquire some knowledge.

At first, I found the costs for proper electrical work very high and almost gave up on it. In the end, it was implemented almost through personal effort at acceptable costs. But when I now see the amounts charged by professional companies for painting or paving the driveway, the investment in future-proof electrical work no longer seems so high to me.

The worst part from my point of view is less the absolute costs but rather the often very poor performance you get for it. This results directly from what wrote:

Yes, the usual. They only do standard and don’t know anything beyond that.

Presumably, it is also because, due to a lack of volume, there is no routine, and this is then compensated for by a hefty "safety surcharge." We are currently right in the middle of the (price) discussion with a so-called automation specialist company ...

First of all, thank you very much for the many contributions, that definitely encourages me not to give up right away here and to see conventional as fixed :)

Have you already looked at the Shellys? That could be sufficient if everything else remains conventional.

I have, that would then be a (cheap) solution for my option 1. Currently I am working with Zigbee, which works relatively well and stable at least within one floor (apartment). With 10,000 EUR you can surely get far here and probably realize all my mentioned points – but only as island solutions. The whole narrative "hardwired, manufacturer independence and thus security for the future" really appeals to me in my own house, hence the attempt to still manage it.

I only see 3a as the only sensible solution.

Mycraft, thank you very much for your long, detailed contribution (and your tireless commitment here to almost every KNX thread to always comment extensively :) ). Glad to read that I can already achieve something with 10,000 EUR and, from your point of view, get the basic setup and there should be enough cable for the other things.

Regarding the controlled residential ventilation, the background here is rather the BAFA subsidy for energy-efficient heating, which currently would not apply to my desired controlled residential ventilation because the heat pump and controlled residential ventilation have to be "technically operated together."

Oh, another one from the area. Which district?

Pankow, we are building in Karow. Do you have a tip for a good address in Berlin where I can explain my concern once for support? I have already read from you in my research the hint about Elektro Paech (here or in the other forum), they are located about 100m away from our construction project in Karow and are on my list.

The worst thing about it, from my point of view, is less the absolute costs but the often very poor performance for it. That directly results from what wrote:

Probably it is also because due to lack of volume the routine is missing and is then compensated for by a strong "safety surcharge." We are currently also in the middle of the (price) discussion with a supposed automation specialist company ...

I would be interested in how high the proportion of new construction projects in the private sector is that ultimately build in a smart home solution (and whether the demand is really so low that the industry sees no pressure to act here)...

Where I am still unsure now, if I had the choice between:
1. Taking the electrical trade out of the construction contract and looking for a competent electrician who installs "as much KNX as possible" in the house for 22,000 EUR (then parameterize myself)
2. Planning with experts, have the control cabinet built accordingly and then let the electrician from the construction company pull all the cables and do the wiring (then parameterize myself)

What would you choose? The more I think about it while typing, the more sense the first solution probably makes and the second as an alternative if the construction company resists... :)

If they agree to "just pull cables," that would be sensible, as long as the price is right. Our electrician wouldn't do that at all because, according to himself, he only makes money on the hardware (at the list price). :rolleyes:

Are you building with a general contractor who is required to provide the electrician, at least for certain services? You mentioned an automation technology specialist company before, so what does your solution look like here?