Passive house as a logical consequence? Are there counterarguments?

Hello Yvonne,

Quite simply: in the (contemporary) quality of the equipment

That is hardly possible with a PH, as there are concrete specifications to be observed.

and fittings.

The above, on the other hand, is possible if and insofar as you and I understand the same by equipment & fittings.

However, I am surprised that one can simply take a standard house as a basis for such a PH or MehrEnergieHaus; I thought more parameters were involved, such as window size and location, i.e. an individually planned house on suitably large terrain.

Or do I not have to apply the requirements for a PH to an MEH?

You can initially configure any design – taking all parameters into account – as a PH; location and orientation then make the house – as one component among many – either "only" significantly or "substantially" more expensive. Moreover, a passive house does not necessarily have to be an energy-plus house (which, in simplified terms, means nothing other than producing more energy than consumed), and an energy-plus house is not automatically a passive house.

Rhenish greetings

The price per square meter we got for a PH was just under €2,040. Additional costs not excluded. I can’t imagine getting by with €1,500 unless the provider saves on materials or good craftsmen. Our energy saving ordinance house is only slightly below that.

As I understand it, the provider is from the neighboring (Eastern) European country. I cannot assess the quality delivered by the provider, nor how enforcement of warranty claims might look later on. However, it is very possible that the wage level is below the German one, which may also be reflected in the price. But would a passive house price below €1,400 come out of that?

So with my traditional solid house construction (right in the west of the republic), almost only (East) European craftsmen were on board. What else is supposed to be saved "in the East"? This level of savings has already almost been reached now.

After a tiring day, I am back home and happy that so much lively discussion has taken place here. So first:

No, it is not an RD house; we have an offer from them for a KfW 70 house. The provider of the PH is from Vogtland (am I actually allowed to name him here?).

Will you then have an instantaneous water heater everywhere, i.e. at all hot water outlets? The buffer tank should be quickly depleted if several people use hot water in the morning...

So there will be 3 people living in the house, for whom a 300l buffer tank should last some time....

The instantaneous water heater is of course in the utility room and heats the water wherever a tap is opened.

I take from the €60,000 additional investment for 30 years (entirely fictional since we don’t know how prices will hold up) €1,000/year for gas. Over 30! years, that's €30,000.

No idea how you get to €60,000, I wrote about a €40,000 additional investment.
In addition, we will get a €10,000 repayment subsidy from the KfW, plus €5,000 subsidy from the SAB for the battery, and then as "entrepreneurs" we also receive the VAT on the photovoltaic system, which all together amounts to €19,000, so we would still be at just over €20,000 additional investment. Since we are getting about €150,000 at better interest conditions, another advantage arises.

What do you actually do with all the stove heat in a passive house? Open the windows and let it out?

Since I want to orient my large windows to the north (to see my garden from the living room and not the street), I will probably have to do some supplementary heating. I imagine that every few days I will burn 2-3 logs of wood. Then it immediately gets warm in the living room and the controlled residential ventilation distributes the heat throughout the entire house. If it gets too warm, I’ll just open a window (a friend of mine has been doing exactly that with a house from this provider for 3 years now...).

It seems to me that Vogtlanders were with a "good" salesman.
I just hope the specifications for this project are correct (orientation, vegetation, neighboring buildings... I’ve done a bit of surfing), so that the yield will indeed be plentiful.

If I’ve only fallen for a "good" salesman, I hope you convince me with facts beforehand, before I get into debt without calculating well enough.

Orientation: exactly south (really!!!)
Vegetation: does not matter (not even in winter, as it is too far and too low)
Neighboring buildings: all plots built on, but same as with vegetation, because the plots south of ours
are lower...

The price per m² we got for a PH was just under €2,040. Additional costs not excluded.
I can’t imagine you can manage with €1,500 unless the provider saves on materials or good craftsmen.

I had written €1,750/m² and the wages here in Saxony are (unfortunately) significantly lower than in the old federal states.

I am a fan of controversial discussion, but still not fixed on a decision. But I believe that better results emerge this way than if everyone just echoes each other.

In this spirit, I remain open to your counterarguments!

Good evening,

So we are getting the Energy Plus house for €210,000 (€1750/m²) fixed price (Energy Saving Ordinance reference house offer would be €160,000, so about 30% less) ... €23,000 costs the photovoltaic + battery ... so €27,000 extra from Energy Saving Ordinance to Passive

I had written €1750/m² .....

So €210k for an Energy Plus house - €27k for photovoltaic + battery results in €183k for the Passive house in my calculation. €183k ./. 120 sqm in turn €1,525.00/sqm. Where is my calculation mistake, which, if there is one, has been trusted by 'EveundGerd'?

Rhenish greetings from the road

My sqm prices stated here are correct! They are current and refer to a PH building in Koblenz without land. I used our house as a comparison, as I also mentioned.

Prices certainly vary by region.

There is, among other things, a comparison by the University of Frankfurt online (? I need to check again. I downloaded it as a pdf) regarding PH and the Energy Saving Ordinance reference house.

The calculation turns in favor of PH after about 30 years. But I will check again.