KfW - Construction supervision / verification / acceptance

  • Erstellt am 2015-11-10 00:04:51

oleda222

2015-11-25 07:58:12
  • #1


One may have any opinion about KfW, the requirements of KfW, etc., but why bypass one of the sensible conditions to appoint an independent expert? The 200 euros you might save can't be worth having someone who also has an interest in covering for the construction company...
 

Kaspatoo

2016-09-08 12:03:24
  • #2
Are colleagues from the Bauherren-Schutzbund (as a member of the Verbraucherzentrale) suitable for this, for example?

What alternatives are there for INDEPENDENT experts?
Any architect from another company?

Wouldn't it make sense for the architect you are planning with to also carry out the independent construction supervision? It seems a bit oversized to me if two architects are involved.
Accordingly, you would just have to make sure that the architect does not belong to the construction company.

However, many construction companies also have their own architectural offices, and you wouldn't want to offend them either. According to the above statements, this doesn't make much sense and would, like a general contractor, just be an unnecessary cost factor... or?

So how is it done most skillfully?
 

Alex85

2016-09-08 12:27:33
  • #3


Independent means someone who is neither personally nor economically connected to the service provider being audited. So choose someone who meets these criteria and is also technically capable of delivering what is required.




As you wish. Or is someone forcing you?
It is and remains your free decision whether and how you control your service providers.
Everything is possible and legitimate between "I have my architect who acts in my interest anyway, that’s enough" and "x hundred thousand of my hard-earned euros depend on that architect and his work. So another pair of eyes should look at it."



Everyone has to know how much they want to put up with and into what position they want to maneuver themselves.
If I want to control the architect, then I do it. Regardless of whose ego that might hurt. We’re not talking about a few euros, but many euros.
If this is not allowed, the contract is not properly placed there. My opinion.
 

Kaspatoo

2016-09-08 14:21:59
  • #4
ok, thank you for the honest answer.

At the Bauherren-Schutzbund (which is part of the Verbraucherzentrale) there are experts who can also carry out construction supervision.
In the city where we want to build, there happens to be one, with whom I have talked on the phone about it.
Also concerning eligibility for funding through KfW.
He himself works full-time in an engineering office and works voluntarily for the Bauherren-Schutzbund.

He said that most companies from the region usually employ external planners, who then mostly also carry out the construction supervision.
As a rule, this was funded by KfW. It does not have to be like this always, but he knows it very often in this form.
He also said that if the planner belongs to the company or if he only works with the company, independence can no longer be guaranteed. Then it probably doesn’t work.
Ultimately, you should ask the contractor whether their planning is eligible for funding, they should know, and this can also be contractually agreed upon.

Otherwise, I can also carry out construction supervision through him, which however does not replace the coordination and management by the executing company.

Furthermore, what I have understood so far quite differently from the KfW site:
According to his statement, the funding of 50%, but a maximum of €4,000, only refers to planning, monitoring, and acceptance services regarding achieving KfW55, keyword insulation.
For example, checking correct reinforcement or that bricks are set precisely is not fundable through KfW.

On the other hand, on the KfW site it states:


as well as:


as well as:



I do not read any limitation to specific KfW parts for construction supervision there.

Therefore, I called KfW and indeed, only the energetic parts are funded.
As a rule of thumb, the funding relates to all activities that a pure energy consultant should be able to perform.
If parts of the calculations, e.g. statics for the roof due to insulation, are performed by an architect, the energetic parts of the architect’s services should be separately listed, the energy consultant can then submit this external invoice at the end of the measure together with his own invoices to the KfW to obtain the funding.

Whether you can substitute the independent energy consultant / expert with the architect who is already involved should be discussed directly with that person if you want to, whether this is possible from his point of view in terms of independence.

Here are a few numbers on costs that were mentioned to me:
- Independent energy consultant with planning, execution supervision, and acceptance (regarding KfW), application and implementation of KfW, calculation, etc. costs about €3,000-5,000 for a single-family house
- 50% of this is reimbursed by KfW
- Additional desired construction supervision (for all non KfW-specific parts), about €250/day (maximum 3 hours at €85/hour at the Bauherren-Schutzbund; plus travel costs, for me none since same location)
- For example, thermal bridge calculation (€100/bridge for about 12-14 bridges per house)
- 8-9 controls = about €2,500 (including basement)

Regarding thermal bridges:
I was told that most contractors and general contractors calculate KfW using the simple model. Upon request, one can (for example he) also calculate thermal bridges individually. This would significantly improve the KfW value (he gave me values from 0.01 to 0.015 for the calculation of thermal bridges and 0.05 for the standard calculation).
He has already recalculated several plans in which gas condensing boilers with solar on the roof were to be installed individually and thus was able to demonstrate KfW55 without additional measures, which the general contractor’s standard calculation would not have reached.

However, if you plan to install a controlled residential ventilation system, the general contractor would already reach KfW55 and you can save the individual calculation.
Or you reduce insulation again, but that probably does not make much sense.

One more thing about the Bauherren-Schutzbund and the Verbraucherzentrale:
I have already learned quite a lot non-binding freely on the phone, I can only recommend it to everyone. The Verbraucherzentrale also offers energy consultations, short talks (mine lasted 25 minutes) via an 0800 number free of charge and personal consultations cost €5/30 minutes as they are subsidized by the state. I have arranged such an appointment, he said on the phone I should expect 60 minutes. I also learned some things on the phone and the €10... no big deal.

In any case, for consultations and services by the Bauherren-Schutzbund, you must first become a member there for about €150/year.
For this, you initially receive a free basic consultation with your own selectable core topic.
The guy I spoke to said that the fee via the Bauherren-Schutzbund of €85/hour is significantly lower than if I commission him directly via his architect office.

In this first conversation, he would, among other things, carry out a heating calculation based on my documents (at least a service description and final floor plans should be available) and can already offer options for achieving KfW55 on that basis.
My general contractors have already done this, but based on their calculation, which I no longer fully trust due to sometimes significant price differences.
 

Bauexperte

2016-09-10 22:25:08
  • #5
Good evening,


I don’t understand ...?


ONLY if the house is actually to be built according to the KFW funding guidelines.


I increasingly think that you only understood this on a rudimentary level ... because you liked your counterpart so much?


From KfW 55 onwards, the accompanying expert is subsidized/funded by the KfW!


I have skipped the rest of your post.

Wherever you live in NRW ... before you sign a contract with your expert, first arrange a meeting at an energy agency near you. I am confident that you will see more clearly afterwards!

Rhenish regards
 

Kaspatoo

2016-09-11 12:41:34
  • #6
That I only receive KfW funding if the KfW55 standard is met is, in my opinion, obvious and taken for granted.

According to the website, the Bauherren-Schutzbund is a member of the Verbraucherzentrale. For me, that means they are on my side because I am the consumer.

Unfortunately, you do not reveal what exactly I am supposed not to have understood.

Regarding the entrepreneur issue, it is as follows:
A planning grant from KfW is only granted if it is carried out by an independent external expert. However, according to the gentleman from the Bauherren-Schutzbund, it often still works if, for example, the planner is externally purchased by the construction company for this project. However, this only works well in the long term if the company does not always hire the same architect but rotates between different ones.
In this case, the planning is already billed by the company (which is transparent for oneself) and still funded by KfW. So I only need, to claim the grant, not necessarily another planner.
Whether this makes sense from an independence perspective is another question.
What this has to do with the fact that I liked the guy is that he indirectly says "you don’t need me."

I actually have a conversation with the energy agency on Tuesday; we will talk about building technology and options. He will certainly not badmouth the gentleman from the Bauherren-Schutzbund because the energy consultant is himself from the Verbraucherzentrale.
Unfortunately, you do not say exactly what you mean, in what way I am now acting blindly.

According to your statement, it seems to me that the information from the gentleman from the Bauherren-Schutzbund is not very trustworthy. So far, I have considered the association independent and consumer-friendly. Is that wrong? Who else can one trust?
 

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