Please evaluate the heating/ventilation concept for the new single-family house construction

And I request the deletion of all attachments, the rights of which I possess.

Mistake.

Rhenish greetings

I strongly and urgently advise you to cease immediately to discredit me; to demean me personally. You have lost all your related credits; accordingly, I have no qualms about banning you from the forum for a while.

I thought to discredit someone you would at least have to allege something negative and false!?

Hi construction expert,

Sure; entirely in the sense that the German generally hears what he sees :confused:

When you read what you sometimes write with a clear mind, I simply have no words...

Just my 2 coins

I want to stay out of your feud with Sebastian, but at one point I have to stick up for him.

Whether you want to admit it or not, heat pumps can be very loud and very annoying. Especially the split units. We have two such candidates in the residential area here. One about 30-35 m from our bedroom window (I think I already described that in another thread) and so loud that you hear it at disturbing volume in winter with the window open. Another prime example is a street away; the thing rattles and clatters like an old Lada shortly before collapse. And both are at most 5 years old, no house here is older.

Yes, it may be that they are wrongly adjusted, poorly maintained or sabotaged by evil aliens. Maybe because of your work you mostly know brand-new systems in perfect condition, maybe those are quiet too.

But the fact is, many heat pumps are loud and annoy their neighbors to no end! There has even been serious trouble here because of the “Lada version.”

And I believe you that there are noise regulations and tests for these devices. But those are probably just as stupid as the noise requirements for cars or motorcycles. Because they are only measured at partial load or certain engine speeds/speeds. At full load they are allowed to drone on as much as they want, including open flap exhausts and the like.

If these noises do not bother you personally, that’s great for you. But please accept that there are people who, even without perfect pitch, find this noise really annoying. And there is a huge difference between having to endure some annoying ripsaw with an organ donor on top every fifteen minutes for 15 seconds during the day in summer or being subjected to continuous droning noise over weeks during every cold period.

I already invited you in the other thread to come by in winter and listen to the noise. Right now you have a wonderful opportunity for that

Best regards,

Andreas

Good evening Andreas,

we have been selling this technology for a little more than 10 years, if I am not mistaken. Either the outdoor units were/are installed at the front of the house or on the side, above the garage; depending on the location of the HAR, sometimes also behind it. Since we also visit existing customers irregularly but repeatedly, one of them would probably have told us about neighbor disputes related to LWWP; don’t you think so? So I will only answer on topics where I can rely on my own experience ;-)

I don’t know which system your neighbors have installed, in Germany there are limit values regarding noise that must be observed.

Currently:

In residential areas, according to TA Lärm, the following limit values for noise immission outside buildings must not be exceeded:

Core areas, mixed-use areas, village areas: Day 60 dB(A), Night 45 dB(A)

General residential areas and small settlement areas: Day 55 dB(A), Night 40 dB(A)

Pure residential areas: Day 50 dB(A), Night 35 dB(A)

Spa areas, hospitals, nursing homes: Day 45 dB(A), Night 35 dB(A)

Inside buildings even stricter limits apply for the noise level of the heat pump or the air heat pump: Day 35 dB(A), Night 25 dB(A)

This means, if your neighbor’s system exceeds the allowed decibels, they have to make improvements; this usually requires little effort, provided the devices comply with European standards. Therefore, I can see no reasonable reason why you shouldn’t pursue this insistently if the noise level is unbearable for you. However, you have to prove that it is too loud. But I think you are aware of that.

Unfortunately, I know numerous examples where neighbors already complain even though the outdoor unit is not even connected yet. And that, although the technology constantly improves in terms of noise. That’s why I write that a person “hears” what he sees and that is why I speak out against sweeping criticism; also against half-hearted justifications.

Again – even the "Lada" you mentioned has to comply with limits. Not cheated, but real; in the worst case, judges don’t mess around.

I can’t see where you live via mobile; if it’s on my way, I will gladly take you up on your offer when I am nearby.

Rhenish greetings on the road
Construction expert

Noise does not bother me that much, but I would not describe 40-45 db as quiet or peaceful. You can definitely hear it, and if you are sensitive to noise, I could imagine that it would be disturbing. And 40 db is already the value for nighttime; there are hardly any purely residential areas, but they are usually designated as general residential areas.

55 db, the daytime limit, corresponds to a vacuum cleaner at a distance of 10m. I definitely would not want to endure something like that from 6 am to 10 pm.

The TA Lärm and its limits date back to the 1960s. As far as I have read, these limits were never adjusted. There is definitely a need for improvement here, just as our ideas regarding diesel exhaust, fine dust, road safety, etc. have changed over the decades.

In Germany, limit values regarding noise must be observed

Apparently, this does not apply to motorcycles and leaf blowers ;-) SCNR

Semi-offtopic: In Switzerland, ventilation systems have lower dB(A) values than in Germany. The better is the enemy of the good.