Bauexperte
2012-10-16 11:36:29
- #1
Hello,
Then, in your place, I would first start by requesting the values of the "initial, in-house trades"; don’t you think? They can talk a lot - but that won’t get you anywhere, as you need reliable figures.
As a rough guideline for you, here are the approximate costs of these trades with normal contracting: architecture - stages 1 to 9 - €25,000.00 (of which roughly €8,500.00 is for site management), structural engineering €2,100.00, and thermal insulation verification €1,600.00. These figures are based on an estimated construction cost of €158,000 for a single-family house of 110 sqm living area as a KfW 70 efficiency house in Brandenburg. In this region, similar to Schleswig-Holstein and Lower Saxony, construction costs are somewhat cheaper.
I have already written elsewhere these days: beware of comparisons that do not last a day. The €130,000 alone is already unrealistic for a single-family home of the desired size - even in Brandenburg; and there is certainly no talk of a KfW efficiency house.
I can well understand your enthusiasm, but you should (still) not bathe in it!
I see the most potential for savings if you can get the engineering services for little money. However, it must be taken into account that these people also don’t live off gifts to third parties. The question is: do they do it at a friend’s price, and if so, within what time frame? All the engineering services required to build a single-family house - starting with the creation of the building application up to the calculation of the thermal insulation verification - take time and therefore cannot be completed hastily. Whether your site manager friend wants to forego a good €8,000, I cannot judge; he certainly won’t do it for free.
The next item is the tendering and awarding of the remaining trades - based on what bill of quantities? The "house construction price" thrown into the ring by the site manager serves most craftsmen only to avoid idle times; they do not generate most of their revenue with it, as the buyers of regional and supraregional providers understand their craft very well. And you should definitely not get involved in black (undeclared) contracts, like the motto: here you save VAT. That will be a very unpleasant awakening!
In my opinion, you should simulate two variants: get 1 - 3 "public" offers based on your desired floor plan and compare these - and only these, so that a comparison is even possible - with the values named to you by your colleagues. Only then is a reliable saving quantifiable. And – what I personally consider important: despite all the "collusion," and that’s what it is, it is important that an independent person monitors the construction project. Or do you want stress at work because, in the worst case, there is disagreement over who is probably responsible for an error?
I once learned never to realize a project with family or friends and have stuck to that to this day. It has always been right so far - whether this maxim does not apply to you, only you can decide :D
Best regards
I work at a company where the most important initial "trades" are active: architects, structural engineers, site managers. The site manager also persuaded me with this line: "Why don’t we just do everything through the colleagues here from the company? I have the executing trades at hand, we just gather all the companies together and then you don’t have to pay the expensive house building companies."
Then, in your place, I would first start by requesting the values of the "initial, in-house trades"; don’t you think? They can talk a lot - but that won’t get you anywhere, as you need reliable figures.
As a rough guideline for you, here are the approximate costs of these trades with normal contracting: architecture - stages 1 to 9 - €25,000.00 (of which roughly €8,500.00 is for site management), structural engineering €2,100.00, and thermal insulation verification €1,600.00. These figures are based on an estimated construction cost of €158,000 for a single-family house of 110 sqm living area as a KfW 70 efficiency house in Brandenburg. In this region, similar to Schleswig-Holstein and Lower Saxony, construction costs are somewhat cheaper.
Okay, I think the idea is good at first. But what I really can’t estimate: how much cheaper will it actually be than with the others? I once looked at the catalogs and prices of a house building company. According to that, such a house would cost around €130,000. Now, my brother-in-law, who just built a house with his buddies (each had a different trade) and still roughly remembers the prices, said that with my colleagues I would get to a maximum of €90,000.
I have already written elsewhere these days: beware of comparisons that do not last a day. The €130,000 alone is already unrealistic for a single-family home of the desired size - even in Brandenburg; and there is certainly no talk of a KfW efficiency house.
Can someone of you who knows about this somehow confirm? I would like to have at least a rough ballpark figure of where the journey is heading. I know we can’t make an exact calculation here, but I would just be interested in whether I will also end up at the house building company’s price or only a bit below it, or if I will really be that much below as my brother-in-law says, or if in the end it might even be EVEN more expensive.
I can well understand your enthusiasm, but you should (still) not bathe in it!
I see the most potential for savings if you can get the engineering services for little money. However, it must be taken into account that these people also don’t live off gifts to third parties. The question is: do they do it at a friend’s price, and if so, within what time frame? All the engineering services required to build a single-family house - starting with the creation of the building application up to the calculation of the thermal insulation verification - take time and therefore cannot be completed hastily. Whether your site manager friend wants to forego a good €8,000, I cannot judge; he certainly won’t do it for free.
The next item is the tendering and awarding of the remaining trades - based on what bill of quantities? The "house construction price" thrown into the ring by the site manager serves most craftsmen only to avoid idle times; they do not generate most of their revenue with it, as the buyers of regional and supraregional providers understand their craft very well. And you should definitely not get involved in black (undeclared) contracts, like the motto: here you save VAT. That will be a very unpleasant awakening!
In my opinion, you should simulate two variants: get 1 - 3 "public" offers based on your desired floor plan and compare these - and only these, so that a comparison is even possible - with the values named to you by your colleagues. Only then is a reliable saving quantifiable. And – what I personally consider important: despite all the "collusion," and that’s what it is, it is important that an independent person monitors the construction project. Or do you want stress at work because, in the worst case, there is disagreement over who is probably responsible for an error?
I once learned never to realize a project with family or friends and have stuck to that to this day. It has always been right so far - whether this maxim does not apply to you, only you can decide :D
Best regards