House construction costs and feasibility

So: 20k is short, even if you get financing, you’re basically tied to the bank’s agent. You need at least 15% cash for various things from all determined and planned costs, things that simply come up and happen with every house construction. Anyone who calculates too tight has a serious problem. Maybe there is a possibility of another "gift" from the parents-in-law so you don’t have to calculate so tight :D? Topic double building: In the end, a construction contract is awarded once and then more volume pays off – as a negotiation lever: For the general contractor it is generally cheaper to pour a whole concrete slab than half, this applies to all other components as well, roof, basement, access, etc. So in the end it comes down to your negotiation skills to negotiate 10% down on the day of the award. That should be possible. Otherwise look for someone else :eek:

So: 20k is short, even if you get financing, you’re still stuck with the bank’s henchman.

Yeah, but there’s no alternative for the next few years anyway, unless I win the lottery :)

You need at least 15% cash from all the calculated and planned costs for miscellaneous things that simply come up in any house build. Anyone who calculates too tightly has a serious problem. Is there maybe a possibility of another "gift" from the parents-in-law so you don’t have to calculate so tightly?

The 270k don’t necessarily have to be planned out 100%... having a bit of a reserve for the unexpected wouldn’t be bad, of course... it depends on what a basement/house that meets my requirements actually costs... is controlled residential ventilation and underfloor heating now "standard" or still rather price-driving luxury?

Depending on interest conditions etc., I’d also take 10k more from the bank... I just didn’t want to exceed €1200/month with 2% repayment at first... and I’ll put it this way: in an emergency, we wouldn’t have to sell the house just because of 5-10k ;)

In the end, it comes down to your negotiating skills to negotiate down another 10% on the day of awarding. That should be possible. Otherwise, look for someone else

10% sounds really good... with those sums, you’re quickly talking about €15-20k+

Hello,

In the end, it all comes down to your negotiating skills to negotiate 10% down on the day of the award. That should be possible. Otherwise, look for someone else

Sorry, when I read such nonsense, it really gets on my nerves :mad:

If a provider is able to give you a 10,000 EUR discount "in the end" of the negotiation, then they already screwed you somewhere earlier; ever thought about that?

Best regards

Hello,

So a total of 250-270k€ is available. The plan is a floor area of ~9x10m and thus a living area of ~130-140m² (ground floor + upper floor) as well as a basement. The basement is intended partly as storage + laundry room, but also 1 room to be used as an office/workroom and another room is also to be habitable as a "reserve"... hobby room etc...

For 140 sqm living space fully basemented – with 2 rooms as living space – you have to calculate TEUR 240/250 per semi-detached house – including underfloor heating, painting and flooring work (ground floor + upper floor) but without boiler. Plus necessary district heating connection costs, TEUR 30-35 additional building costs, plus reserve for extras.

By the way, the new development area is connected to a district heating network which you MUST use! That means I can save the money for a heat pump etc... If I’m correctly informed, that’s easily ~10k+ in investment capital I save because I don’t need my own heating system.

I would ask again and possibly consider whether the amount of the penalty – in case you don’t use district heating – pays off.

I mean, you write at one point that the district heating comes from the waste incineration plant .... well, on my property tax bill this year, waste disposal has become more expensive again. Given this development, it is foreseeable when district heating will also become more expensive; please keep in mind that with this type of heat generation you will always be at the mercy of others; regardless of which producer supplies the district heating. €uro magazine has already written quite a bit about the pros and cons, which you should consider.

Is this realistic so far? Can I get a basement + house with middle-upper range finishes for that money? (underfloor heating, not the cheapest flooring etc) at least KFW70 standard? Maybe even some money left for outdoor facilities/garage?

So far, I come to a sum of TEUR 270/285 per semi-detached house and without district heating connection costs. This sum assumes only a house compliant with the Energy Saving Ordinance, without outdoor facilities, garage or let alone necessary technology for a Kfw 70 efficiency house ;)

What I also wonder all the time is how much savings there are because we build 2 semi-detached houses? I’ve already read that the savings when building a semi-detached house are not particularly large... but how about if you build 2 semi-detached houses at the same time with the same developer? That’s more like 1 very big house of 9x20m, right?

But you do want to build 2 houses, right? And do not want to give up any trades on either house?

You can’t compare a complete semi-detached house with a larger single-family house; this comparison is flawed because a *single* family house typically only requires 1 residential unit, only 1 front door, or one heating/electrical circuit, etc. For a semi-detached house, you generally need all this and much more twice. What you effectively save is, with earthworks, 1x the trip(s) and a little on the construction fence/construction toilet; that’s about it in the big picture.

How about the additional building costs if you build simultaneously/together? That will surely be cheaper compared to a single-family house?

As described in the previous paragraph, otherwise the additional building costs for each semi-detached house remain roughly the same amount of TEUR 30-35.

Kind regards

Hello construction expert,

thank you for your detailed answers!

So far, I come to a total of TEUR 270/285 per semi-detached house and without connection costs for district heating. This sum only assumes one house according to the valid Energy Saving Ordinance, without outdoor facilities, garage or let alone the necessary technology for a KfW 70 efficiency house

so the 30-35k additional construction costs are included in that, right?
How much of that does the basement consume?
What additional costs would be necessary for KfW70 or what needs to be done? Controlled living space ventilation, better insulation, etc.?

I would ask again and possibly consider whether the amount of the penalty - in case you do not take district heating - is worth it.

I mean, you write at one point that district heating comes from the waste incineration plant .... now in my property tax notice this year, waste disposal has become more expensive again. Given this development, it is foreseeable when district heating will also become more expensive; please consider that with this form of heat generation you will always be in someone else's hands; regardless of which producer the district heating comes from. €uro has already written quite a bit about the pros and cons, which you should think about.

With the heat pump, I am also dependent on the electricity provider, right?
At 3.5 cents/kWh, even an air-water heat pump with a performance factor of 4 can hardly compete... the electricity price would have to drop below 14 cents/kWh... and then additional investment costs of about ~15k + reserves for repairs + interest costs for the 15k...
honestly, I have no idea how this is ever supposed to pay off.
The main advantage of district heating for us or the reason why a heat pump surprisingly does not pay off for us compared to district heating is the fact that district heating is free for the municipality! The costs only arise for the maintenance of the pipeline network, etc...

But you do want to build 2 houses, right? And also not do without any trades in either house?

As I said, I don’t know the construction industry well, but in almost all other industries there are often discounts if you buy more... If you buy 2 cars from the car dealer around the corner at once, you can certainly negotiate more... without having to do without anything on the cars!

You cannot compare a complete semi-detached house with a larger single-family house; this comparison is misleading, as in *a* single-family house, normally only 1 residential unit, only 1 front door or respectively one heating/electrical circuit etc. is needed. In a semi-detached house, you need this and much more usually 2 times.

I don’t want to save on these things either... but there are also some things that correspond to a large single-family house... for example when masonry or the roof or plastering, you certainly save money there or can negotiate quantity discounts... but well, I don’t expect too much at this point... the 10% mentioned seemed a bit high to me anyway... I rather thought it would be in the range of 5-10k...

Hello,

so the 30-35k additional construction costs are already included, right?

Yes.

How much of that is consumed by the basement?

Good 40,000 EUR

What additional costs would be necessary for KfW70 or what needs to be done? Controlled residential ventilation, better insulation, etc.?

I can’t answer that for you; district heating is not that simple. The structural engineer/technical building equipment planner must calculate precisely – for example, when calculating the KfW 70 efficiency standard, it also depends on how the district heating is classified energetically, etc.

With the heat pump, I’m also dependent on the electricity provider... right?

Sort of, since the electricity market had to be opened, you can switch providers every year – if you want to. The big advantage is that you can switch; with district heating, that isn’t the case. In the long term, future builders will no longer ask if they heat with electricity, but how the electricity is generated. In the short to medium term, photovoltaics and their storage will also become cheaper – if you accept the district heating connection, this investment would not pay off just for household electricity; but if a heat pump is installed, the situation looks very different again. Small wind turbines are also being tested, as well as other innovative and future-proof technologies like fuel cells, for example. In my opinion, you are making the mistake of looking at the current costs/a supposed saving and not focusing on future costs/opportunities.

As I said, I don’t know the construction industry well, but in almost all other industries there are often discounts when you buy more... If you buy two cars from the dealer around the corner, you can probably negotiate more... without giving up anything on the cars!

Car dealerships are sponsored by manufacturers through different subsidy models; if you buy re-imports, different tax rates apply – all not comparable. When building a car, only one “craftsman” is at work, with house building, several more are involved. Since the craft companies that have long-term contracts with larger suppliers don’t earn the most anyway, they can hardly afford to forego further profits. A well-established craft business that knows how to value its delivered services, that has several “mouths to feed” or is responsible to its employees, will definitely not engage in this “being cheap is cool” game; because then their good reputation and solvency would soon be gone anyway ;)

I don’t want to save on these things either... but there are also some things that correspond to a large single-family house... for example, with masonry or roofing or plastering, you can certainly save money or negotiate volume discounts... but okay, I won’t expect too much here... the 10% mentioned sounded a bit high to me anyway... thought more in the range of 5-10k...

You can supposedly only save when building a house if you contract all trades yourself, starting with the architect and ending with the door maker; according to all experience, however, you don’t really save because you invest the seemingly saved funds in better craft companies/higher quality materials or simply cannot negotiate the discounts you apparently envision.

And one thing you should definitely keep in mind: the providers who grant more than 1, maximum 2% discount upon signing:

- have already screwed you in the beginning
- are latently affected by insolvency
- sooner or later you will find them negatively in the HBF or the media

Building as cheaply as possible and as expensively as necessary is absolutely desirable. Comparing house building with buying a car, on the other hand, is very foolish and in most cases ends up being very expensive in the final bill; true to the motto “after quite firm comes quite loose” ;)

Best regards