New single-family house or core renovation of a house built in 1978

1500 per 2m definitely won’t be maxed out, but the new build with demolition, basement, etc. of that size easily costs 3000€ per 2m, so renovating is easily 200k to 250k cheaper!

You are contradicting yourself... not 1500 for a complete refurbishment, but 3000 for a new build? Where is this huge difference coming from?

Normally, 750€ per sqm is enough to bring the house up to energetic and technical new-build standard. No additional costs or architect fees apply.

Now that’s ridiculous... where do you get this number from? In the house everything is supposed to be redone except the walls and the basement. That is about 600€/m² for a new build. The difference to 2000-2200 or even 3000 as says is coming out of nowhere? Someone spoke up ( ) who did a refurbishment themselves and says they don’t even know if it was more expensive. I also see it right now with friends, complete refurbishment of a multi-family house with 400m², they are slowly approaching a million.

You contradict yourself... not 1500 with a complete gut renovation, but 3000 with a new build? Where is this huge difference supposed to come from?

Now this is getting ridiculous... where do you get this number from?

In the house, everything is supposed to be redone except the walls and the basement.
That is about 600€/m² for a new build. Does the difference to 2000-2200 or even 3000 as writes fall from the sky?
Someone spoke up ( ) who did a gut renovation himself and says he doesn't know if it was even more expensive.

I also see it right now with friends, gut renovating a multi-family house with 400m², they are slowly heading towards a million.

I have done a gut renovation myself. Therefore, I still do not allow myself to judge regarding the costs. First, check what needs or should be done.
For example, the roof rarely has to be done after some time. More often it is the insulation. That is then 3000€ instead of 30k.
The electrical wiring is probably already 3-core. That means expanding and not completely new.
Windows might have already been done. Or a glass replacement might be worthwhile.
The heating is the question. Water and sewage are interesting. Steel pipes should go and be replaced. Copper can stay.
So, as mentioned in my first post: check the current state.
By the way, with 130 sqm, I am at 460€/sqm. However, only two terrace doors and two large windows had to be replaced.

I completed the full renovation of a house from the 60s a month ago. Unfortunately, I am still missing the evaluation because I neglected the paperwork heavily.

I must have paid around 1600€/m². Kitchen, outdoor facilities, etc. of course not included.

There were some nasty price drivers here:
- Layout changes with removal of load-bearing walls
- Unused chimney shaft removed over 4 floors
- New screed in half of the house
- Completely new interior plaster, as it was a disgusting, smelly smoker's den
- Completely new installation: electricity, water, sewage, heating
- Two new dormers
- Facade insulated with mineral wool instead of plastic

If you are satisfied with the existing condition, such a project can definitely approach 1000€/m², or even well below that if you can and want to do a lot yourself.

I did a full renovation myself. Therefore, I still don't allow myself to judge the costs. First, check what needs to be done and/or should be done. For example, the roof rarely has to be redone after some time. More often the insulation. That's then €3000 instead of €30k. The electricity is probably already 3-core. So expand it, not completely new. Windows might already have been done. Or a glass replacement might be worthwhile. Heating is the question. Water and sewage are interesting. Steel pipes should be removed and replaced. Copper can stay. So as I mentioned in my first post: check what the status is. By the way, for 130 sqm I'm at €460/sqm. However, only two terrace doors and two large windows had to be replaced.

It's not a full renovation. The original poster writes in the first post that he only wants to keep the walls standing; logically, the costs therefore relate to that. Insulation and paint on the walls are clear, a completely different matter.

Now this is getting ridiculous.. where do you get this number from?

Own experience from the last few years. Current offer from the main contractor for my new existing two-family house. Content: 80sqm upper floor apartment gets new radiators, new windows Uw approx. 0.8 with manual shutters Ground floor apartment 120sqm is gutted, new underfloor heating with 20mm insulation WLG 23, new electrical + sanitary lines, bathroom + guest toilet new, windows like upper floor + electric shutters, new front door, flush interior doors new, decentralized ventilation, insulating the basement ceiling 100mm WLG 23, flat roof extension internal insulation 120mm WLG 22, perimeter insulation 120mm WLG 35, basement (20sqm extension) external insulation 120mm WLG 32, facade insulation with two-tone broom finish plaster 120mm WLG 22, Haro country house plank parquet on 100sqm, new heating 2x 5kW heat pumps, 9.9kWp photovoltaic system, top floor ceiling is insulated with 2x140mm WLG 35 mineral wool (already lightly insulated) ==> with some buffer for about €80k for a then KfW 55 house (almost KfW 40) – but the KfW subsidy of 40% on a large part of the work will be deducted. Oh yes, on the ground floor with 120sqm only the walls remain (floor plan will be only slightly adjusted). On the upper floor I can’t really indulge myself yet thanks to the tenant. And off the top of my head, I wouldn’t know how to spend more luxury either. And no, I don’t live by the Adw, but in the Düsseldorf catchment area. And yes, it’s not my first property. Besides the above-mentioned complete offer, I also obtained individual offers. Rather small and local companies. They are all at a similar level. Honestly, I wouldn’t even know what to spend so much money on. I don’t need the structural engineer or the architect, otherwise it would be a bit more expensive. PS: My last house I built for well under €1,500 per sqm including all incidental costs (including photovoltaic, geothermal, etc.). That was just over four years ago, but it also involved some own work. You just have to know your way around the subject and be willing to invest time. I can and want to do both.

There were some nasty cost drivers here: - Changes to the floor plan including removal of load-bearing walls - Removal of unused chimney shaft over 4 floors - New screed in half of the house - Completely new interior plaster, because it was a foul-smelling smoker's apartment - Completely new installation: electricity, water, sewage, heating - Two new dormers - Facade insulated with mineral wool instead of plastic

These are indeed cost drivers. That’s why I asked what exactly is going to be done and how. And if the floor plan fits and/or chimney flues don’t get in the way or plastic on the exterior wall isn’t a big deal, that already helps a great deal.