Liability question - fire protection correction in a semi-detached house

  • Erstellt am 2023-10-09 09:51:03

LastCookie

2023-10-11 15:24:05
  • #1


Hey, thanks a lot first of all for your detailed answer. I interpret this as meaning that the whole thing could be booked under "entrepreneurial risk"? I find it somewhat cheeky that the GC here tries to exploit the customers' ignorance. He has done this several times before, but the situation is different now. The house is finished, we live in it, and still have money owed to him (because we haven’t done final acceptance yet, among other reasons because the fire protection and roof issues are still far from resolved).

Even though I could sit this out to a certain extent (he also doesn’t budge on the outstanding amount, which is five-figure), I still want the work to be completed and the house to be accepted by the authority.

For understanding, here is a brief summary:
- We had a permit from the authority with the original architect’s plans, which, however, did not show the separation of the houses in the fine details
- It only became apparent during a spontaneous shell acceptance (the inspector came by bike)
- I also told the gentleman why the authority issued a building permit and hadn’t noticed this before or communicated any conditions... I can’t remember the exact wording anymore. It goes without saying, the architect should do his homework, etc.

I have attached the architect’s solution, which was approved by the authority. Now someone just has to do it.

Regarding the semi-detached house itself, it does offer us some advantages that the ridge runs like this and not differently (I’m missing the technical term here)... we were able to install floor-to-ceiling windows in every room upstairs. And the roof slopes only begin at 1.55 m – otherwise, we would have roof slopes and thus only skylights in the rooms upstairs.

The fire protection issue is totally annoying, and ideally, I would like to come to some agreement, but I think he will stick to his opinion, and in the end, a lawyer will have to settle it.
 

11ant

2023-10-11 16:16:57
  • #2

Yes and no, rather entrepreneurial negligence. The architect (who here, as I understand it, was the disguised BT) must know the fire protection requirements and observe them regardless of whether they are pointed out before the building permit is granted or not. Fire protection is not a "criminal offense on application" ;-) but mandatory.

Add the previous planning as well.
 

Simon-189

2023-10-12 06:52:56
  • #3
Hello,

I know from steel and industrial construction that two adjacent, independent buildings or halls can independently burn and collapse (must be able to). To prevent fire spread from one half of the roof to the other, the fire or F90 wall must extend 50 cm above the top edge of the roof covering or the outer edge of the facade.

However, I do not know exactly which DIN standard regulates this and whether there is such a requirement for residential houses.

Constructively, the sketch seems questionable to me. Assuming there is indeed a fire on one side of a house and it partially collapses, the falling rafters would take parts of the Promat cladding with them and the fire would also start on the other side.
 

11ant

2023-10-12 14:23:30
  • #4
It is called fireprotection for a good reason, not fireabsolute safety; the devil is in the details. What is required are so-called fire resistance classes—"F90" means, for example, that a component can be exposed to a fire for 90 minutes before it loses its structural function. Here there is probably the same misunderstanding as interpreting the best-before date on food as an expiration date (meaning, assuming uninterrupted proper storage, it should keep an acceptable consistency until then). Of course, the fire protection here is already favorably predisposed by the construction type "o" (house chain interruption at the latest after 50 meters) compared to a factory hall with technical gases already present in the supply lines. Accordingly, the whole effort depends on a smaller bell. If this semi-detached house suffers a fire extending into the second half, the local fire department can handle it alone; neither the district administrator nor the television will come. It will never be a major incident. Transferred to your horror scenario that means: someone in "a test tube in Rosenheim" *ROTFL* *SCNR* looked at the stopwatch to see that the cladding lets the ridge purlin go to hell only in the 91st minute. After the deluge comes the insurance expert ;-)
 

LastCookie

2023-10-12 22:06:56
  • #5
Hello everyone,

thanks for the contributions. 11ant is right regarding the topic of fire protection, it is about preventing the fire from spreading for a certain period of time (here 90 minutes).

It is also not about sense or nonsense, but about who pays for the fun and what the legal situation behind it looks like, as I am trying to realistically assess my chances for a possible court case.

we moved a few months ago and what I currently can't find in any of the moving boxes are the documents for the building permit. If I find anything, I will submit it here.
 

11ant

2023-10-12 23:40:56
  • #6

They are not relevant here. Fire protection must be observed - regardless of whether the building authority includes a note about it as a condition in the permit or not. The architect simply should have known that the protective panels need to be installed there - whether drawn in or not. The building authority does not regularly check detailed drawings.

You bear no blame regarding the existence and legal status of the fire protection regulations. The disguised BT forgot to account for the panels and integrate them into the construction process. The authority acted appropriately by giving notice of the oversight instead of shutting down the construction site. The fault lies with the architect (of the BT) - he was asleep, you are completely out of it. The BT should try to hold his architect liable (for the additional costs of the subsequent rather than early completion). You can (unless you get a bottle as a lawyer) stay relaxed. You are not responsible for the panels, nor for the additional costs of their subsequent installation.
 

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