KFW70 with gas-solar heating

  • Erstellt am 2015-04-17 21:01:08

Sebastian79

2015-04-18 11:08:08
  • #1
Yes? Of course you have a difference and I definitely do not want to elevate our 14 cm as an optimal insulation standard - but just calculate: You get a difference of 0.044 W/m²K - convert that into savings per year and then the additional costs (not only for the insulation material).

There is a lot of smoke and mirrors there... unfortunately.
 

LittleWulf

2015-04-18 11:37:15
  • #2
A question already popped into my head yesterday, can I possibly achieve the KFW70 without the solar thermal system on the gas heating through controlled residential ventilation? Because the solar thermal system was also described to us as not really useful/necessary?
 

Legurit

2015-04-18 11:49:38
  • #3
Yes... Use the search function or Wikipedia. Solar thermal energy does not have to be used to achieve KFW70.

According to statements on the web, this saves €140 per year at a 60% coverage rate (60% of the energy for hot water comes from solar) (cf. Thorben Frahm). Costs for 5 m² according to the same website €3760 (assumption: 160 l / day 60% coverage rate). Without subsidies, the system has to be on the roof for 31 years (20 € p.a. maintenance - without interest costs)... so financially not really worth it for new buildings.
In our village, for example, such systems are still subsidized with €40 per m²! Still not very sensible.
 

Mycraft

2015-04-18 11:58:34
  • #4
Only the controlled residential ventilation is not sufficient... further replacement measures must follow...
 

Ben1000

2015-04-19 10:12:05
  • #5
Kfw 70 with a gas heating system without solar thermal is very difficult (not sensible?) to achieve. A standard prefab house builder will probably not manage that and above all will have little desire to do so. The building must be very well insulated and also meet the standard of a good passive house (orientation, planning, etc.). Our house will significantly undershoot the insulation values of a KFW 55 house. However, due to the gas heating, KFW 70 is still not achievable without solar thermal. We do not have a controlled residential ventilation system, but according to our energy consultant, that would not have been sufficient instead of the solar system anyway. The solar system is now installed for environmental protection. Economically it certainly isn’t (the controlled residential ventilation system isn’t either, by the way). By the way, I also find Lexmaul’s consideration good. The insulation of buildings will indeed reach a peak at some point. But considering that over 50% of the total waste production in Germany comes from the construction sector, I think one should definitely think about what materials are used in one’s house! The energy consumption of the construction industry is also immense, and a lot can be saved there as well. I am not sure whether it is the right path to heavily insulate buildings with resource-consuming and waste-intensive building materials, only to face the problem in a few decades of where to dispose of all the hazardous waste. For that reason, I advocate that in the discussion about KFW, one should not only talk about the wallet but also about the environment: because that is what this funding should really be about, isn’t it?!
 

Legurit

2015-04-19 10:29:21
  • #6
So honestly... what is politics supposed to do to reduce energy consumption? It only comes down to insulation or promoting environmentally friendly energy production... especially since the latter also involves making the country somewhat more independent (more political-strategic considerations). That works well... houses have an actual heating load of 6 kW and no longer 30 like in the past! You have to let that sink in.
 

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