Geothermal energy or gas condensing boiler?

Advertising link? That was just a source, but okay as text:

An online shop is not an info page!

It was about a source for the price, I can hardly find this on the manufacturer’s site.

Hello,

A normal gas boiler flow temperature; but not a proper gas condensing boiler, I simply don’t believe that... sorry. A good Viessmann for example starts at €4.4k and that doesn’t even include installation costs.
This discussion is, in my opinion, pointless insofar as you won’t get far with "just" gas under the new Energy Saving Ordinance; it’s also not enough to simply add solar for domestic hot water. That doesn’t comply with the current Energy Saving Ordinance.

I refrained from posting the links. But a Viessmann Vitodens 300 W (which according to the Viessmann homepage is their high-end product) can be delivered to your home for a good €3000 including mounting material, flue pipe, and warranty extension(!!). Sure, you can probably find someone to sell it to you for €4400, but you don’t have to buy it there...
The Viessmann 300 can’t be that outrageously expensive, it was the standard for 3 out of 4 general contractors I spoke to.

Under the current Energy Saving Ordinance, gas and solar for domestic hot water is sufficient. Otherwise, in the vicinity of about 200 meters here, at least 20 houses would have been built illegally and I would be interested in how the general contractor plans to fulfill my order...

Anyway, I do not claim that this table is always and for everyone accurate. It also always depends on local conditions and personal preferences. Here, for example, a gas connection seems cheaper than elsewhere, and only a heat pump with indoor installation would be an option for me. I always want to stick a rod in the fan of those damned noisy outdoor units... And with indoor installation it immediately becomes significantly more expensive, the unit is more expensive, then I need a waterproof shaft for the breakthrough in the white tank etc.... That is quite a bit more than a gas connection and flue pipe cost.

But conditions are different for everyone.


Best regards,
Andreas

Andreas

Why should gas not be possible according to the new energy saving regulation?

Search here in the threads; it has been frequently discussed recently to the extent that a new edition is necessary.

4,500 EUR subsidy for the ground source heat pump offset?

Yes, that only mitigates the drilling risk in a rudimentary way. Rhine regards

Hello Andreas,

With the current Energy Saving Ordinance, gas and solar are sufficient for domestic water. Otherwise, at least 20 houses within a radius of about 200 m here would have been built illegally

That was not possible here (NRW) in a single case; without controlled residential ventilation with heat recovery, no Kfw 70 certification.

I always want to stick a stick into the fan of those damn noisy outdoor units...

Then you seem to be more than just sensitive to noise; some birds with their morning songs are louder.

Rhenish greetings

Hi Bauexperte,

That was not possible here (NRW) in a single case; no KfW 70 certification without controlled residential ventilation with heat recovery.

Then you seem to be more than just noise sensitive; some birds with their morning song are louder.

It may well be that none of the houses have a KfW 70 certification. But what use is that to me? The subsidy for KfW 70 is unspectacular, it’s not worth paying an extra few thousand euros.

For KfW 55 and 40 it’s even less worth it. Then it’s more a question of whether you want to ease your conscience with such a house.

But then you should better forego holiday trips, that makes a much bigger difference:

A single holiday flight of a family of four from Hamburg to Gran Canaria roughly corresponds to about 1000 liters of kerosene consumption (=1000 heating oil = 10000 kWh).

So this one holiday flight emits as much CO2 as the heating at home for the whole year!!!

When I think that in the past I flew up to 12 times a year to Asia for work, I actually shouldn’t turn on heating for the rest of my life.

Driving a smaller car also helps the environment much more than any controlled residential ventilation or whatever, with which you then laboriously save 1000 kWh. Ironically, the T5 Bullis, Mercedes M-Classes or Q7s then stand in front of the houses whose owners are very proud of their KfW 55 or whatever status…

Just from such things you can see how silly the discussion is about whether such a house consumes 8 or 12 thousand kWh. That actually doesn’t matter at all…

But that’s not for us to decide, the laws are as they are and we have to deal with that.

Bauexperte, if you’re in the area here in winter, come by. I’ll gladly show you lots of heat pumps that with fans running at full load below 0°C make noise. You feel like you’re on the runway of an airport among running airplane turbines. The worst case is our neighbor diagonally opposite. His outdoor unit is 35 meters (measured!!!) away from our bedroom window. From 5 °C upwards, that thing drones so loudly that we can hear it with the window open and find it disturbing. He also complains about somewhat high electricity costs…

And no, I’m not a musician with perfect pitch, my wife feels the same.

These are the heat pumps I know and since no supplier has so far wanted to guarantee a maximum noise level in writing (let alone a guaranteed annual performance factor), that is obviously the current state of the art.

Best regards,

Andreas