Semi-detached new build, which technology to install?

  • Erstellt am 2020-04-12 22:50:52

untergasse43

2020-04-16 07:57:39
  • #1
The Shellys work quite well already, but the sentence from the quote rather points to fundamental understanding problems. Why use IFTTT for scenarios with Shellys when you have ioBroker? I would NEVER entrust building automation to a cloud service and solve basic things with IFTTT. That’s kind of nice for gimmicks (when I come home by car, the car tells the house via IFTTT, etc.), but nothing more. If the cleaning lady ever pulls the cable from the server out of the wall, you have a problem. The only open question in the setup is actually ioBroker. If Shelly loses interest someday, you go looking for other manufacturers compatible with your remaining system.
 

Denk_Mal19

2020-04-16 09:59:08
  • #2
Controlling an air-to-water heat pump via smartphone and APP (Abwesenheitsmodus) may be technically possible and even fancy - but it is technically pointless. An air-to-water heat pump as well as ventilation or a compact unit with both components should be intelligently demand-controlled with sensors in the rooms (temperature/ CO2/ occupancy sensor). This provides the highest energy efficiency and best comfort. I don't have to think about switching anything on via smartphone or such. Moreover, a underfloor heating system is slow. If I switch on the heating 1 hour before coming home, the rooms are still cooled down at that time. So, it should always be left running ...
 

MBPassion

2020-04-18 17:56:09
  • #3
I am also planning a complete renovation of the entire electrical system, and I would like to have CAT8 cables installed there, which have a fairly large diameter with AWG22. For example, one like this:


CAT7 certainly already exceeds the requirements regarding possible data rates today, but I have no empty conduits and do not want to have to chisel into the walls again. I expect higher performance with Power-over-Ethernet later on from a larger diameter.

Regardless of CAT7 or CAT8, I would definitely advise you to mount the cables with keystones at both ends (at least on the patch panel side): this is much easier and cables can later be re-plugged easily. For example, such as these:


The patch panel must then be unpopulated for keystones, for example one like this:


Otherwise, I am also planning to have at least one double socket installed in every room, plus a single line in some ceilings for access points, and one double socket per corridor floor. The room planning plays a small role here.

Furthermore, I am considering an IP-based video intercom system such as from Doorbird. It also makes sense to lay a cable to there. The same would apply to outdoor cameras if you need something like that. These components can then be conveniently powered via PoE without an additional power connection.

Besides the patch panel where the installation cables end, you will also need short patch cables connected to a switch. For example, such as these:


If you end up with a lot of cables, a 19" server cabinet that houses the patch panel and switch, as well as any other components (NAS, router/modem, etc.) is worthwhile. For example, one like this:

including a power strip, for example one like this:


If you want to power components via PoE (access points, cameras, intercom, ...), then use a PoE-capable switch. There are many of those. Personally, I tend to prefer the Unifi Switch Pro 24 PoE GEN2, but that will probably be too expensive for most.

To connect these components, you can either supply a socket with a patch cable to the component, or you can save the socket and terminate the installation cable directly with a network plug like the following:


So, just some advice. I also receive no commission for the links used -- you can certainly find similar components in other webshops. But I think this way it can be better imagined.
 

C.beckmann1986

2020-04-21 16:00:15
  • #4
Now I have to bring up the topic again. I will probably forgo the complete KNX, as it will likely blow the budget and I probably wouldn't use it to that extent anyway. Currently, it is most important to me that I can remotely control the electric roller shutters. According to the building specifications, a simple toggle switch is currently being installed. What do I think should be possible?

- central opening/closing via app, voice command, and of course automated according to previously programmed patterns.
- both individual roller shutters and all together
- darkening of the rooms when the indoor temperature is too high

Have I forgotten anything important?

Additionally, I would like to smartly control a few lamps. In the hallway or stairwell, for example, with motion detectors. In the bathroom or living area with additional indirect lighting for a nice atmosphere.

The air-water heat pump runs on its own, without constant regulation. So temperature control in the individual rooms is probably unnecessary.

I don’t really mind having to use 2-3 apps for this at the moment. But of course not significantly more...

Which system would suit me best for this?
So far, I have really liked free@Home and Homematic IP. While one is wired, the other is radio-based.
I am very grateful for further tips.
 

untergasse43

2020-04-21 16:43:40
  • #5
Free@Home is almost a KNX, just with crappy visualization and restriction of the actually available technology to Busch-Jäger. In your case, you could take a look at OPUS. It is a German manufacturer and it works with a standard installation, can be upgraded later as desired, and fits into normal switch programs. It is of course a radio system, since bus systems are beyond your budget. We have had extremely good experiences with it and if you want, you can later also expand via IP (Homekit etc.). For example, you could first buy the shutter actuators and later also replace the light switches with OPUS.
 

Mycraft

2020-04-21 17:17:16
  • #6

Well, various things that go beyond if/then. You simply can’t foresee and program everything in advance.


A few is always a road to nowhere. If you do it, you have to do it properly and integrate everything – it’s useless if you automate various things but still have to go to the light switch in room XY to perform an action. Here’s my tip: all or nothing... regardless of which lamps and systems you use.


Yes, good idea, but even here a concept and integration into the rest of the system is very advantageous, e.g. for alarms.


ERR yes, unnecessary. But control and monitoring are sometimes interesting and useful.


Multiple apps often also mean that the devices don’t communicate with each other, which is often not useful. But if you’re okay with that, that’s just how it is—it's your house.


I agree with Untergasse43: free@Home = KNX without freedoms. No price advantage compared to KNX and only one manufacturer. So all the disadvantages are combined in this system. The supposed programming on the tablet does not at all outweigh the limitations, but it’s still bought. Crazy world.

Homematic IP is basically free@Home over radio, so actually also out.
 

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