Is an architect really that expensive?

I wouldn't say that so generally... I think that GÜs who have their standard craftsmen can also achieve cost advantages... (Craftsmen don't have to write 10 offers etc.)

Standard craftsmen have architects just like GÜ and GU. On the contrary; since the price is paid by the client, it is not the price but the quality that is primary when choosing the craftsmen.

But then you contradict the argument with the affordable individual awarding. This means, in conclusion, that architect-designed houses always have higher quality but also always higher prices (including premium, since these craftsmen can choose their customers).

Good morning,

These costs also occur for the manufacturer; he just charges them or actually has lower incidental building costs because he sells a standardized product.

This is no more universally true than

In a word: it is not more expensive to build with an architect, just different.

this supposed statement.

I know, in both approaches, exactly opposite examples.

You can quickly forget the capitalized "individual" when there are more than 2-3 walls that you want to move.

That exists, that is correct, but there are also plenty of other examples.

We can chat a lot here from the bottom of the barrel, have invested a lot of time and experienced quite a bit.

I’m not asking myself for the first time which providers are meant in such reports.

There are—both in prefabricated and solid house construction—many providers who are quite well adapted to implementing builders’ wishes; precisely not insisting on their standard houses. Providers, for example, who only calculate the statics after submission of the approved building permit without conditions.

A highlight was when we inquired about an automatic roller shutter control just for the ground floor; it was already planned electrically. The two necessary packages were then supposed to cost a fixed 12,000 euros extra; we had them removed again.

Then you inquired with a rather low-priced provider who cannot cost-effectively deviate from his standard framework. In these cases, every deviation from the basic contract costs disproportionately more than the other features.

What you actually pay for usually remains concealed.

That’s what the basic contract is for; if these are not meaningful, the wrong provider was contacted.

For us, building should above all become: trust, trust, and transparency.

All builders think/hope so.

It is of course very helpful if somehow you get a recommendation for an architect.

An approach, yes. But the human component is also important. Who your neighbor raves about in the highest terms does not necessarily have to be the best choice for your construction project.

So one cannot generalize either in one direction or the other. Once again, it depends.

Rhenish regards

But then you make the argument for cheap individual contracting absurd. It means, in conclusion, that architect-designed houses always have higher quality but also always higher prices (including premium, since these craftsmen can choose their customers).

Not necessarily. It depends on what you want - at least with every craft business you have a say and can decide for yourself whether price or quality should be the priority. Besides, expensive does not always mean better.

In my opinion, direct awarding of trades is the cheapest way to build sensibly. If someone gives you a fixed price for a bundle of services, they make the cost risk expensive. They will certainly calculate in such a way that they end up with a profit. The services required for house construction are usually the same.

The general contractor usually has a few of their own people who then take over structural work and other labor-intensive trades for 20 EUR gross including employer’s contribution, while the client Lieschen Müller awards this service externally and pays 60-80 EUR for the craftsman hour. The general contractor has their craftsmen and orders 20 houses a year there, i.e., they are a major client for the craft business. Discounts of up to 50 percent compared to inquiries from the client Lieschen Müller are certainly not uncommon.

Once again, numbers pulled out of thin air – for 20 euros gross, I can barely get a black market worker... ok, that’s also net.

Moreover, the argument regarding the GUs with their mass orders and the resulting price discounts is indeed correct, but it’s rather wrong that the GU simply passes this on 1:1. That’s where it falls short...

I could never have built my house here with a GU – neither in that size nor for that price. But it did cost quite a bit of sweat (though less than some might imagine), nerves, and of course time – for that, with a traditional architect’s house you can have more say (with all its pros and cons), you can literally take almost every stone in your own hands, you can work on it yourself without the unbearable warranty exclusions (which are then formulated quite extensively).

And you have price transparency… plus the security of paying only for what is already there.

These are my experiences with building and I know that this definitely is not a construction method for everyone. But for the typical man it is certainly ideal, since he wants to do everything himself preferably.

No, seriously: there’s no right or wrong here – everyone pays how they can and depending on their willingness/ability.