Dear existing property with renovation or new construction

One decides to purchase and renovate/restore an old building if the location of the property and the plot are clearly more advantageous than those of a comparable new building. Most prospective buyers I advise explicitly do not want to build in a new development area but are looking for an individual property with history in an established environment. The renovation and conversion costs can then approach the costs of a comparable new building if the old structure is fundamentally altered (removal of load-bearing walls, supports, underpinning, ceiling openings, new roof structure). Otherwise, the pure conversion costs (cost group 300 + 400) will generally amount to about 3/5 to 4/5 of the costs of a new building, plus, of course, the purchase and ancillary purchase costs for the property.

An old-building-experienced expert/surveyor/architect can indeed accurately assess the condition of an old building, of course only after "visual inspection" and measured against what he can visually judge or what can be derived from any existing documentation (building permit plans, building description). Nevertheless, the existing building always remains a "grab bag" that can only be opened once the property has come into your possession. Surprises during renovation are to be expected in principle. To minimize them as much as possible, a comprehensive and detailed building survey/building substance analysis should be carried out after purchase and before the start of renovation planning, during which concealed and multilayered component structures can be opened and examined.

So if the situation is comparable, I would take 2 in your position. Yes, it will probably come down to 600k. However, with 1 you won't get cheaper. I also advise against doing major renovations in an inhabited house. If it's now "only" kitchen and windows, that would still be okay. But with that construction year, I suspect the overall condition of water, sewage, electricity, roof, insulation... to be old. In addition to what you described. I see 1 all in rather at 700k. But that's just a guess. If you would describe 1 in more detail, it might be easier.

Thank you already for the further responses.

If you would describe 1 in more detail, it might be easier to handle.

I'll give it a try.

Paraphrased from the exposé:
Year of construction 1940.
Living space: approx. 150 m²
Usable area approx. 170 m²
3 rooms ground floor
2 rooms upper floor
3 bathrooms
3 (!) kitchens/kitchenettes
Basement (unknown size, I suspect only partial, only accessible from outside)
Garage (2 parking spaces)
1 balcony (upper floor)

There were renovations in 1995 and 2010, during which the roof was insulated (I don’t know how yet), the windows were renewed with shutters (judging by the pictures, these are no longer from 1940 either, but I can only say more after inspecting), full thermal insulation was applied (no idea exactly what that means), the 3 bathrooms were renewed and the garage and garden gates were converted to electric opening.
Currently, there are two residential units without internal connection (external staircase to the 1st upper floor), so one unit could initially be rented out (which is quite conceivable for us).
The building is relatively narrow and long, approx. 6x16 m, with a conservatory of 3x3.8 m attached at the widest point and on the other side the building tapers to approx. 4.5 m over the last 5 m (all external dimensions). The narrow side probably may not be extended because the property boundary is too close there.
The heating consists of two separate heating circuits with gas-fired floor heating in the basement (one per residential unit), age unknown so far. Electrical circuits are said to be separate as well. The roof has wooden paneling on the inside, so I cannot tell from the pictures how it was insulated. From the outside it looks like roofing felt to me as a layman.

The narrow structure results in an impractical room layout, as there is no hallway from which all rooms are accessible; this was circumvented in the existing structure in such a way that bathrooms and kitchens are designed as walk-through rooms on the one hand, and on the ground floor a hallway leads only to a walk-through bathroom and a living kitchen, another hallway then leads to the other rooms (kitchen, living room, small room).

Sorry that I can’t simply attach a floor plan, but at the moment I only have those from the exposé, which I am not allowed to simply publish here. I would submit a hand-drawn sketch as soon as possible.

I will try to obtain further information and documents during the inspection.
We drove by the property today (discreetly and stayed in the car) to better assess the location, and my partner meanwhile also likes the location (playground and park next door. New elementary school in the neighborhood).

Yes, I hope this helps for better assessments; I am aware that floor plans and more information on the condition would be more useful, and I will provide those as soon as available.

Best regards

Tolentino

Roof and full thermal insulation sound good so far.
If both were done in 2010, it might be that only the windows need to be done. Provided this has not already been done, of course.
The electrical work as another major item is still missing for me.

In addition, the division into two residential units with an external staircase can be very advantageous. Occupy one unit, renovate the other gradually. With luck, this is also possible with water and sewage, electricity, provided it has not been done.

How do you assess your handyman skills and your autodidactic abilities?
To me, this sounds like a nice property for craftsmen to save money. But you have to want that and also have some talent.

Roof and full thermal insulation sound good so far. If both were done in 2010, it may be that only the windows need to be replaced, provided this has not already been done, of course. The electrical system as another major item is still missing for me. In addition, dividing into two residential units with an external staircase can be very advantageous. Occupy one unit and gradually renovate the other. If you're lucky, this works with water and sewage, electricity, if not already done. How do you see your manual skills and how are your self-taught abilities? To me, this sounds like a nice property for craftsmen to save money. But you have to want that and have some talent.

Well, as I said, I have hardly any experience and especially very little time (sole earner). I would consider my talent slightly above average, my comprehension very good. My partner has a lot of time and motivation, but is not very resilient for health reasons. My father-in-law is a trained craftsman and has already renovated an even older old building by himself. Only whether he can put so much time into it is not yet clear (he lives 2 hours away and also works). However, he has many contacts, and my hope would be that I could have quite a bit done at almost cost price... Yes, on the one hand, it is something you could really do a lot with, but you have to invest a lot. A little like a classic car, a collector’s item.

Then discuss extensively and think it over. Sounds more like pure hope to save money. I say (from the gut): take number 2.