Provider, prices, costs, experiences

Dear Homebuilding Community,

My wife and I have been planning to build a house for some time and would like to start in the spring of next year. Before I get to my questions, I would first like to introduce our project and the current status.

The plot of land is currently still owned by my parents-in-law. However, a subdivision survey is to take place in the next few days and weeks, so that a gift agreement can be arranged at the notary afterward. Once this is done, we would be 1,000 sqm richer, which corresponds to a value of about 80,000 to 90,000 euros.
On this plot of land in Alpen (Lower Rhine/NRW) we plan to build a single-family house with a total of 135 sqm according to DIN. A floor plan of our hopefully future house already exists and includes an external dimension of 9m x 11m. On this area, the ground floor shall accommodate an entrance hall, study, kitchen, guest WC, utility room, and an open living/dining area. On the upper floor are planned 2 children's rooms, a small storage room, a small bathroom for the children, a bedroom with a walk-in closet, and a master bathroom. A basement is not planned. Storage space will be created under the roof instead.
The single-family house should be a KfW 70 or KfW 55 house, preferably a KfW 55 from our side. Accordingly, the house should have an air heat pump with an appropriate underfloor heating system. An automatic ventilation system with heat recovery is also desired. Further extras would be raising the knee wall to 100 cm, a single-flue chimney, electric shutters for all windows (except the two skylights), and an additional entrance door from the garage to the house. The garage should preferably have a size of 3.5 m width by 9 m length. Furthermore, we plan to install a photovoltaic system, as one roof side will be completely oriented to the south. Oh yes, and one of the most important things: We want to build solidly, specifically with bricks and an ETICS. Please, no discussions about why we want bricks and not Ytong or KS; we have spent the last months having these discussions.
That much about our house project.

Now we were not entirely lazy and have, of course, approached several developers / construction companies. Besides the price-performance ratio, it is especially important to us that we feel comfortable with the builder and feel that we can build with them. For this reason, for example, Town & Country and Euro-Massivhaus are already out of the running for us. Currently, we have offers from a local architect, from Rötzer Ziegel Element Haus, and from IBG Haus. An offer from a local developer is still pending.
In any case, the three offers we have differ particularly in price, which of course confuses my wife and me a bit. Added to that are comments from our parents that the offers obtained so far are way too high and that everyone just wants to rip us off. To be a bit more specific:

The architect calculated costs of 198,000 euros for a single-family house with 135 sqm as a KfW 70 house. His architect’s fee and his fee as construction management are already included in this amount. Additionally, garage, photovoltaic system, automatic ventilation system, tiles, flooring, painting work, paving work, outdoor facilities, and earthworks will be added.
Rötzer Ziegel Element Haus gave us an offer for the same house, but as a KfW 55 variant, amounting to 190,000 euros. Garage, photovoltaic system, tiles, flooring, painting work, paving work, outdoor facilities, and earthworks are also missing in this amount. However, the automatic ventilation system is included.
Last but not least, IBG sent us an offer, also for a KfW 55 variant. The offer of 200,000 euros includes tiles, garage (prefabricated garage from Zapf / 3 x 9m), a ventilation system, and even a photovoltaic system. If I deduct the costs for the garage and the photovoltaic system to be able to compare better, I come to 172,000 euros. Flooring, painting, paving, outdoor facilities, and earthworks are still missing.

Now to my questions:

Is a KfW 55 house generally preferable to a KfW 70 house? Are the additional costs for a KfW 55 variant worthwhile?
Are the described offers reasonable or, as our parents claim, much too high?
What price is realistic for our construction project?
Do you know of affordable and reliable developers / construction companies near us (Alpen at the Lower Rhine in NRW)?
Does anyone have experience with Rötzer Ziegel Element Haus and how are those? (Note: The contact person from Rötzer Ziegel Element Haus said that “something could still be done” on the price, but only if we give a verbal commitment that we really want to build with Rötzer Ziegel Element Haus. Also, a detailed building description is only available after the verbal commitment.)
What are the experiences with IBG Haus? Are they still threatened by insolvency or are they even insolvent?
Oh, regarding the garage - Since we are planning a slightly wider garage of 3.5 m width, the offer from Juwel precast concrete garages with 16,500 euros somewhat shocked us. Does anyone know a manufacturer of precast concrete garages of this size with more favorable conditions? Or does it even make sense to build a garage of this size by ourselves? Does anyone know what materials should then be calculated?

As you can see, there are many questions. I hope I haven’t overloaded you with my post and look forward to your answers.

Best regards
Schuschi

Hi,

I have already answered most of your questions.

There was something fishy with IBG Haus. So they should be excluded as well. Search here in the forum.

Now, seeing your post here and seeing what you already have included (for example, we don't have a fireplace either), your offer seems less and less attractive.

I don’t consider the Rötzer Ziegel Element Haus offer too expensive, even considering that maybe the price can still be negotiated. If your parents say it’s all too expensive, they should just find you a cheaper construction company.

As I already hinted in a private message, everyone cooks with water only and no one has anything to give away. That’s why I am generally suspicious of cheap offers. They must be cutting somewhere, whether it’s on materials, construction quality, etc.

Hello,

Is a KfW 55 house generally preferable to a KfW 70 house? Do the additional costs for a KfW 55 variant pay off?

You have to ask all your providers what the surcharge for KfW 55 in their offer amounts to. Only then can the mentioned surcharge be put into relation to the probable "added value". As a rule, in my experience, you save a maximum of €100 with KfW 55 compared to KfW 70; it is your decision whether that is worth an extra charge.

Are the described offers reasonable or, as our parents claim, much too high?

If you trust your parents more, you should consider the advice from "Häuslebauer"
From experience, I would want to answer that all offers – measured against your equipment wishes – are too low.

What price is realistic for our construction project?

EUR 210-220 thousand turnkey (i.e. without painting and carpet) as a KfW 55 efficiency house plus electric shutters for all windows (except the two skylights), side house door, plus garage, plus photovoltaic, plus ancillary construction costs EUR 30 - 35 thousand

Does anyone have experience with Rötzer Ziegel Element Haus? Also, there is a detailed construction description only after the verbal commitment)

I can only keep wondering; do you want to buy a pig in a poke, decide with the risk that you might not like the construction description? How else, other than based on a meaningful construction description as well as the entire contract package from a provider, do you want to be able to decide?

Oh, about the garage - since we plan a somewhat wider garage of 3.5 m width, the offer from Juwel precast concrete garages with €16,500 shocked us a bit. Does anyone know a manufacturer of precast concrete garages in this size at better conditions? Or does it even make sense to build a garage of this size yourself? Does anyone know what material costs should be calculated then?

Manufacturers of prefabricated garages score especially with standard dimensions; everything that deviates from this requires additional permits, night transports, and escort vehicles. The mentioned price is therefore completely justified; if built in masonry, it should cost comparably due to the share of craftsmen hours.

Kind regards

Thank you very much, home builders and construction experts, for your previous answers!

Regarding the price, we are just a bit cautious, after all, you don’t build a house every day. About a year ago, when we discussed a new build, we based our price expectations somewhat on our parents and other acquaintances, who, however, built new houses about 10 or more years ago. After we approached the first developers, it quickly became clear to us that we could only count on about 200 thousand euros for the house without additional costs. However, we didn’t really know or weren’t sure whether this was correct or if they were just trying to rip us off. Especially my parents find it hard to imagine that a new build has become a bit more expensive nowadays, also because with the Energy Saving Ordinance 2009 or a KfW70/55 standard, more technology and insulation have to be installed, which also costs more. But that’s what such a forum and nice people are for, who clearly tell you how the prices stand. I think I will invite my parents to read this post and other posts here in the forum. Otherwise, I gladly take your advice, Häuslebauer40.

But as I hear from both of you, the price of Rötzer Ziegel Element Haus seems to be okay. I am a bit unsure about IBG accordingly, since this offer is really very cheap and there is already quite a bit about IBG to read here in the forum—not necessarily positive. I am curious what the still-pending developer will calculate for us.

We will also talk again with Rötzer Ziegel Element Haus regarding a construction description and the price reduction—before we commit to anything or even sign.

: What would you say if the garage is built by ourselves and thus no labor costs are incurred? What costs can be expected just for the material? And which brick is best suited for a garage? The garage does not necessarily need 45 cm exterior walls. I want the garage to be stable but with walls as thin as possible so we don’t lose too much interior space in the garage.

Best regards, Schuschi

Hello,

As I can hear from both of them, the price of the Rötzer Ziegel Element House seems to be okay.

I do not know this provider! And - as already written several times here - I am skeptical about hollow brick, especially in connection with ETICS. Accordingly, you should actually base my answer purely on the price indication of this provider. What I think about the manner of disclosing the BB only upon order confirmation, I do not need to argue anymore.

What would you say if the garage is built by yourself and thus no craftsman hours are incurred. What costs can be expected for material only?

That depends on your connections to the local building material trade.

Last year, I procured the stones for one of our customers through my contacts for self-building a garage; these were aerated concrete blocks 62.5x25x24 for an asymmetrical garage 4.5 x 9 m (front 4.5 m and back 3.0 m). With foundation slab, gate, window, and flat roof, from memory in my opinion material costs were in the range of EUR 8,500 - 9,500.

Kind regards

Hello,

...Is a KfW 55 house generally preferable to a KfW 70 house? Do the additional costs for a KfW 55 variant pay off?

This can be sufficiently clarified with a consumption forecast based on the real conditions!
Anyone who buys a house without an independent sales forecast risks throwing a significant amount of money away.

Best regards.